Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

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Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:44 am

Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia thumbs up

Europe is a LARGER Continent then Australia. As a matter of FACT; Australia is the SMALLEST/RUNT Continent. And as large it may be, the size of your EGO makes it uncomfortably confining. But hey, that's only one of your many lies and deceptions. Let's talk about Mizraim, the Hebrew word for Egypt. You say it isn't. Where is your credentialed support for your ignorant nonsense? thumbs up

http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Mizraim.html

Meaning and etymology of the name Mizraim
Mizraim


Mizraim is a son of Ham, son of Noah (Genesis 12:10). This name is also the common name for Egypt (which is also known as 'the land of Ham,', for instance in Psalm 105:23).

Egypt was known by the names Musuru, Musru, Misir or Masri in other languages, and Mizraim is probably simply a phonetic transliteration into Hebrew of any of them. The word looks identical to what a dual form of would look like (see below). This duality possibly helped to denote Upper and Lower Egypt. The word for Egyptian is .

The similar (masor), a poetic nickname for Egypt that is used on three different occasions (Isaiah 19:6, 2 Kings 19:24 = Isaiah 37:25, Micah 7:12), may shed some understanding on how a Hebrew audience might have interpreted the name Mizraim.

The noun (masor) means siege, entrenchment, and it derives from the verb (sur), bind, besiege. Another derivation of this same verb is the noun , stronghold. HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament notes that a stronghold or walled city may be an instrument of protection during the first stages of a war, but will turn into a lethal trap if a siege last long. A beautiful figurative use of this word occurs in Psalm 31:21, where the author compares himself under siege by his troubles.

The verb from which the noun derives, is part of a group of five different roots. These roots all have different linguistic sources but were perhaps readily incorporated into the Hebrew language due to similar or related meanings, more or less:
(swr) is the assumed root of the words (sawwar), neck and (sawwaron), necklace. The neck is simply a part of the body, but figuratively it is used as seat of strength (Job 39:19) and subsequently as target of defeat (by the placing of the victor's foot on the neck of the conquered - Joshua 10:24). The similarity between a necklace and a besieging army is obvious.
The verb (sur) means to bind or besiege; referred to above.
The verb (sur) means show hostility to, be an adversary. According to BDB Theological Dictionary and HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is probably a by-form of (sarar), see below.
The verb (sur) means to form or fashion. According to HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is possibly a by-form of (yasar), form or fashion.
The noun (sur) does not occur in the Bible, but is probably related to words in cognate languages that mean rock or hill. A derivative that does occur in the Bible is (sur), the common Biblical word for rock. BDB Theological Dictionary suggests relations with (sara), see below.

The words and are linguistically closely related. Their respective meanings also shows much kinship:
The verb (sarar) means to bind, be narrow/ confined, be in distress. Derivatives are: (sar), narrow, tight; (sar), distress; (sara), straights, distress; (sarar), suffer distress; (seror), bundle; (mesar), straights, distress. The latter word written in a dual form would yield the name , Mizraim. Jones' Dictionary of Old Testament Proper Names assumed that this is what Mizraim would have meant to a Hebrew audience and reads Double Distress.
The verb (sarar) means show hostility towards. Derivation (sar) means adversary.
The assumed root (srr) is unused in the Bible but in Arabic it means be sharp. Its common derivative is (sar), pebble, flint.

The name Mizraim means Double Distress or Double Stronghold.



Bible Dictionary

Mizraim definition


the dual form of matzor, meaning a "mound" or "fortress," the name of a people descended from Ham (Gen. 10:6, 13; 1 Chr. 1:8, 11). It was the name generally given by the Hebrews to the land of Egypt (q.v.), and may denote the two Egypts, the Upper and the Lower. The modern Arabic name for Egypt is Muzr.


Mizraim From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mizraim
Mizraim (Hebrew: מִצְרַיִם / מִצְרָיִם, Modern Mitzráyim Tiberian Miṣrāyim / Miṣráyim ; cf. Arabic مصر, Miṣr) is the Hebrew name for the land of Egypt, with the dual suffix -āyim, perhaps referring to the "two Egypts": Upper Egypt and Lower Egypt.

Ugaritic inscriptions refer to Egypt as Msrm, in the Amarna tablets it is called Misri, and Assyrian and Babylonian records called Egypt Musur and Musri. The Arabic word for Egypt is Misr (pronounced Masr in Egyptian colloquial Arabic), and Egypt's official name is Gumhuriyah Misr al-'Arabiyah (the Arab Republic of Egypt).

According to Genesis 10, Mizraim (a son of Ham) was the younger brother of Cush and elder brother of Phut and Canaan, whose families together made up the Hamite branch of Noah's descendants. Mizraim's sons were Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, Casluhim (out of whom came Philistim), and Caphtorim.[1]

According to Eusebius' Chronicon, Manetho had suggested that the great age of antiquity in which the later Egyptians boasted had actually preceded the flood, and that they were really descended from Mizraim, who settled there anew. A similar story is related by medieval Islamic historians such as Sibt ibn al-Jawzi, the Egyptian Ibn Abd-el-Hakem, and the Persians al-Tabari and Muhammad Khwandamir, stating that the pyramids, etc. had been built by the wicked races before the deluge, but that Noah's descendant Mizraim (Masar or Mesr) was entrusted with reoccupying the region afterward. The Islamic accounts also make Masar the son of a Bansar or Beisar and grandson of Ham, rather than a direct son of Ham, and add that he lived to the age of 700. Some scholars think it likely that Mizraim is a dual form of the word Misr meaning "land", and was translated literally into Ancient Egyptian as Ta-Wy (the Two Lands) by early pharaohs at Thebes, who later founded the Middle Kingdom.

But according to George Syncellus, the Book of Sothis, supposedly by Manetho, had identified Mizraim with the legendary first pharaoh Menes, said to have unified the Old Kingdom and built Memphis. Misraim also seems to correspond to Misor, said in Phoenician mythology to have been father of Taautus who was given Egypt, and later scholars noticed that this also recalls Menes, whose son or successor was said to be Athothis.

In Judaism, Mitzrayim has been connected with the word meitzar (מיצר), meaning "sea strait", possibly alluding to narrow gulfs from both sides of Sinai peninsula. It also can mean "boundaries, limits, restrictions" or "narrow place".[citation needed]

However, author David Rohl has suggested a different interpretation: "Amongst the followers of Meskiagkasher [Cush] was his younger 'brother' -- in his own right a strong and charismatic leader of men. He is the head of the falcon tribe -- the descendants of Horus the 'Far Distant'. The Bible calls this new Horus-king 'Mizraim' but this name is, in reality, no more than an epithet. It means 'follower of Asr' or 'Asar' (Arabic m-asr with the Egyptian preposition m 'from'). Mizraim is merely m-Izra with the majestic plural ending 'im'. Likewise, that other great Semitic-speaking people -- the Assyrians -- called the country of the pharaohs 'Musri' (m-Usri)." [2]


Genesis 10 - The Table of Nations
http://www.enduringword.com/commentaries/0110.htm
The tenth chapter of Genesis . . . stands absolutely alone in ancient literature, without a remote parallel, even among the Greeks, where we find the closest approach to a distribution of peoples in genealogical framework . . . The Table of Nations remains an astonishing accurate document. (William F. Albright, cited in Boice)

A. The descendants of Japheth.

1. (1) The three sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

Now this is the genealogy of the sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth. And sons were born to them after the flood.

2. (2) The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

The sons of Japheth were Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

a. The sons of Japheth: He was the father of the Indo-European peoples, those stretching from India to the shores of Western Europe. They are each linked by linguistic similarities that often seem invisible to the layman but are much more obvious to the linguist.

b. Gomer: From this son of Japheth came the Germanic peoples, from whom came most of the original peoples of Western Europe. These include the original French, Spanish, and Celtic settlers.

c. Magog . . . Tubal, Meshech: These settled in the far north of Europe and became the Russian peoples.

d. Madai: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Medes and they populated what are now Iran and Iraq. The peoples of India also came from this branch of Japheth’s family.

e. Javan: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Greeks, whose sea-faring ways are described in Genesis 10:5.

3. (3) The sons of Gomer.

The sons of Gomer were Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah.

a. Ashkenaz: From this son of Gomer came the peoples who settled north of Judea into what we call the Fertile Crescent.

b. Togarmah: From this son of Gomer came the Armenians.

4. (4-5) The sons of Javan (the ancient Greeks).

The sons of Javan were Elishah, Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim. From these the coastland peoples of the Gentiles were separated into their lands, everyone according to his language, according to their families, into their nations.

a. The sons of Javan were: Geographic names that spring from these names in this chapter abound. Linguists have no trouble seeing the connection between Kittim and Cyprus, Rodanim and Rhodes, Gomer and Germany, Meschech and Moscow, Tubal and Tobolsk.

B. The descendants of Ham.

1. (6) The sons of Ham: Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

The sons of Ham were Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

a. Ham: The descendants of Ham are the peoples who populated Africa and the Far East.

b. Cush: Apparently, this family divided into two branches early. Some founded Babylon (notably, Nimrod) and others founded Ethiopia.

c. Mizraim: This is another way the Bible refers to Egypt. Put refers to Libya, the region of North Africa west of Egypt. Canaan refers to the peoples who originally settled the land we today think of as Israel and its surrounding regions.
2. (7-12) The sons of Cush.

The sons of Cush were Seba, Havilah, Sabtah, Raamah, and Sabtechah; and the sons of Raamah were Sheba and Dedan. Cush begot Nimrod; he began to be a mighty one on the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord; therefore it is said, “Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord.” And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, Erech, Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar. From that land he went to Assyria and built Nineveh, Rehoboth Ir, Calah, and Resen between Nineveh and Calah (that is the principal city).



a. Cush begot Nimrod: One son of Cush worthy of note is Nimrod. He was a mighty one on the earth, but not in a good way. He ruled over Babel, which was the first organized rebellion of humans against God. The name Nimrod itself means, “let us rebel.”



b. Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord: The context shows that this is not a compliment of Nimrod. The idea is that Nimrod was an offense before the face of God.



i. “This is not talking about Nimrod’s ability to hunt wild game. He was not a hunter of animals. He was a hunter of men - a warrior. It was through his ability to fight and kill and rule ruthlessly that his kingdom of the Euphrates valley city states was consolidated.” (Boice)



ii. A Jerusalem Targum says: “He was powerful in hunting and in wickedness before the Lord, for he was a hunter of the sons of men, and he said to them, ‘Depart from the judgment of the Lord, and adhere to the judgment of Nimrod!’ Therefore it is said: ‘As Nimrod the strong one, strong in hunting, and in wickedness before the Lord.’ ”



iii. Ginzberg quotes from a Jewish legend: “The great success that attended all of Nimrod’s undertakings produced a sinister effect. Men no longer trusted in God, but rather in their own prowess and ability, an attitude to which Nimrod tried to convert the whole world.”

iv. “Hence it is likely that Nimrod, having acquired power, used it in tyranny and oppression; and by rapine and violence founded the domination which was the first distinguished by the name of a kingdom on the face of the earth. How many kingdoms have been founded in the same way, in various ages and nations from that time to the present! From the Nimrods of the earth, God deliver the world!” (Clarke)

3. (13-14) The sons of Mizraim.

Mizraim begot Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, and Casluhim (from whom came the Philistines and Caphtorim).

4. (15-19) The sons of Canaan.

Canaan begot Sidon his firstborn, and Heth; the Jebusite, the Amorite, and the Girgashite; the Hivite, the Arkite, and the Sinite; the Arvadite, the Zemarite, and the Hamathite. Afterward the families of the Canaanites were dispersed. And the border of the Canaanites was from Sidon as you go toward Gerar, as far as Gaza; then as you go toward Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboiim, as far as Lasha.

a. Canaan begot Sidon: The family of Sidon, the son of Canaan, went north and is related to the Hittites and Lebanese.

b. And the Sinite: Many people believe the Oriental peoples descended from the Sinites.

5. (20) The spread of the descendants of Ham.

These were the sons of Ham, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands and in their nations.

C. The descendants of Shem.

1. (21-22) The sons of Shem: Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

And children were born also to Shem, the father of all the children of Eber, the brother of Japheth the elder. The sons of Shem were Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

a. Children were born also to Shem: From Shem comes Elam, who was an ancestor to the Persian peoples; Asshur, who was the father of the Assyrians; Lud was father to the Lydians who lived for a time in Asia Minor; and Aram was father to the Arameans, who we also know as the Syrians. Arphaxad was the ancestor to Abram and the Hebrews.

2. (23) The sons of Aram.

The sons of Aram were Uz, Hul, Gether, and Mash.

a. Uz: Later, a region in Arabia was named after this son of Aram.

Job came from the land of Uz (Job 1:1).

3. (24-30) The sons and descendants of Arphaxad.

Arphaxad begot Salah, and Salah begot Eber. To Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg, for in his days the earth was divided; and his brother’s name was Joktan. Joktan begot Almodad, Sheleph, Hazarmaveth, Jerah, Hadoram, Uzal, Diklah, Obal, Abimael, Sheba, Ophir, Havilah, and Jobab. All these were the sons of Joktan. And their dwelling place was from Mesha as you go toward Sephar, the mountain of the east.

a. All these were the sons of Joktan: The names under the son of Joktan (son of Eber, son of Salah, son of Arphaxad) are all associated with various Arabic peoples.

b. And Jobab: The one named Jobab may be the one we know as Job in the Old Testament.

4. (31) The spread of the descendants of Shem.

These were the sons of Shem, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands, according to their nations.
5. (32) Summary statement: the nations after the flood.

These were the families of the sons of Noah, according to their generations, in their nations; and from these the nations were divided on the earth after the flood.

a. “Hence one must consider this chapter of Genesis a mirror in which to discern that we human beings are, namely, creatures so marred by sin that we have no knowledge of our own origin, not even of God Himself, our Creator, unless the Word of God reveals these sparks of divine light to us from afar . . . This knowledge the Holy Scriptures reveal to us. Those who are without them live in error, uncertainty, and boundless ungodliness; for they have no knowledge about who they are and whence they came.” (Luther, cited in Boice)
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MIZRAIM = EGYPT

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You also deceive about the Replacement/Superssessionism Theology......This is Strike 3 and a few more to go. thumbs up

http://www.biblestudyproject.org/israel3.1-replacement-theology-messianic.htm

The Truth

We believe Israel is God's special people, distinct from the body of Messiah, chosen by Him to be a holy nation and a Kingdom of priests. The election of Israel is irrevocable. . . . We believe the Abrahamic Covenant is an irrevocable, unconditional covenant God made with Jewish people. This covenant provides title to the land of Israel for the Jewish people and promises a descendant (the Messiah) who would come to redeem Israel and bless the entire world. The spiritual blessings of the Abrahamic Covenant overflow to all the nations. God will ultimately fulfill every aspect of the covenant in the Messianic Kingdom, both physical and spiritual. . . .
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Your LIE!!!!!!!

A. SUPERSESSIONISM OR REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY

The meaning of this doctrine is that the church superseded or replaced Israel as God's covenant people. The three claims presented under this heading are:
1. God has rejected Israel,
2. the church has replaced Israel as God's covenant people, and
3. the church is therefore spiritual Israel.

If God has rejected Israel, then that clears the way for a replacement people; and if that people is the church, then the church may be considered spiritual Israel. It is also conceivable that some who believe that Israel is still God's covenant people would consider the church spiritual Israel because it is composed of people whose spirits have been regenerated by the Holy Spirit. We will now hold the light of Scripture to these claims and possibilities.
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Paul follows his emphatic response with, for I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. . . . What is his point? If God had rejected Israel as His covenant people, then every Israelite would be disqualified from the possibility of being saved; yet he is an Israelite who is saved, and that proves that God has not rejected His people.

To sum up, we have noticed two proofs that God has not rejected Israel as His covenant people:
1. By the very meaning of May it never be! in the way that Paul used it in different contexts.
2. By the fact that Paul was a saved Israelite.


Nevertheless, we'll address several passages that need clarification.

b. Romans 11:1-5

1. I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2. God has not rejected His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says in the passage about Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel? 3. "Lord, THEY HAVE KILLED YOUR PROPHETS, THEY HAVE TORN DOWN YOUR ALTARS, AND I ALONE AM LEFT, AND THEY ARE SEEKING MY LIFE." 4. But what is the divine response to him? "I HAVE KEPT for Myself SEVEN THOUSAND MEN WHO HAVE NOT BOWED THE KNEE TO BAAL." 5. In the same way then, there has also come to be at the present time a remnant according to God's gracious choice.



Replacement Theology

Its Origins, Teachings and Errors

By Dr. Gary Hedrick, President of CJF Ministries

(With Minor Editing By Rabbi Loren)

http://www.shema.com/Combating%20Replacement%20Theology/crt-004.php

http://www.therefinersfire.org/replacement_theology.htm

These are serious errors/deformations in your Theology and Worldview. What do you have to say for yourself. You gibber on and on about being persecuted yet you, yourself; are the persecuter. You lie about the Jews and their Sacred scriptures and you attempt to steal their identity and destiny, without being able to read/write Hebrew. Your ignorance and hubris is appalling Capiche? thumbs up


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Last edited by el kabong on Mon Aug 08, 2011 8:05 am; edited 2 times in total
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MoMo

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Zion/Zionism

Post  MoMo on Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:48 am

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JESUS AND THE IDENTITY OF GOD

http://www.ntwrightpage.com/Wright_JIG.htm

Some theologies, e.g., ancient Epicureanism and modern Deism, believe in a god, or gods, but think they have nothing much to do with the world in which we live. Others, like Stoicism, believe that god, or “the divine,” or “the sacred” is simply a dimension of our world, so that “god” and the world end up being pretty much the same thing. Both of these can give birth to practical or theoretical atheism. The first can let its “god” get so far away that he disappears. This is what happened with Marx and Feuerbach in the nineteenth century, allowing the “absentee landlord” of eighteenth-century Deism to become simply an absentee. The second can get so used to various “gods” around the place that it ceases to care much about them. This is what happened with a good deal of ancient paganism in Greece and Rome, until, as Pliny wryly remarks, the arrival of Christianity stirred up pagans to a fresh devotion to their gods.[9]

The Jews believed in a quite different “god.” This god, YHWH, “the One Who Is,” the Sovereign One, was not simply the objectification of forces and drives within the world, but was the maker of all that exists. Several biblical books, or parts thereof, are devoted to exploring the difference between YHWH and the pagan idols: Daniel, Isaiah 40-55, and a good many Psalms spring obviously to mind. The theme is summed up in the Jewish daily prayer: “YHWH our God, YHWH is one!”[10]

Classic Jewish monotheism, then, believed that (a) there was one God, who created heaven and earth and who remained in close and dynamic relation with his creation; and that (b) this God had called Israel to be his special people. This twin belief, tested to the limit and beyond through Israel’s checkered career, was characteristically expressed through a particular narrative: the chosen people were also the rescued people, liberated from slavery in Egypt, marked out by the gift of Torah, established in their land, exiled because of disobedience, but promised a glorious return and final settlement. Jewish-style monotheism meant living in this story and trusting in this one true God, the God of creation and covenant, of Exodus and Return.

This God was utterly different from the pantheist’s “one god.” This is an important point to note: many, including many scholars, have blithely assumed that because Stoics and others talked about “one god” they were saying the same thing as the Jews. This God was also utterly different from the far-away ultra-transcendent gods of the Epicureans. Always active within his world, did he not feed the young ravens when they called upon him?[11]—he could be trusted to act more specifically on behalf of Israel. His eventual overthrow of pagan power at the political would be the revelation of his overthrow of the false gods of the nations. His vindication of his people, liberating them finally from all their oppressors, would also be the vindication of his own name and reputation. In justifying his people, he would himself be justified. In his righteousness, his covenant faithfulness, they would find their own.

This monotheism was never, in our period, an inner analysis of the being of the one God. It was always a way of saying, frequently at great risk: our God is the true God, and your gods are worthless idols. It was a way of holding on to hope. We can see the dynamic of this monotheism working its way out in the manifold crises of second-temple Judaism, with the Maccabees, Judas the Galilean, and above all the two wars of the late 60s and early 130s A.D. revealing how the creational and covenantal theology and worldview remained at work through the period and in different groups.

This God was both other than the world and continually active within it. The words “transcendent” and “immanent,” we should note, are pointers to this double belief, but do not clarify it much. Because this God is thus simultaneously other than his people and present with them, Jews of Jesus’ day had developed several ways of speaking about the activity of this God in which they attempted to hold together, because they dared not separate, these twin truths. Emboldened by deep-rooted traditions, they explored what appears to us a strange, swirling sense of a rhythm of mutual relations within the very being of the one God: a to-and-fro, a give-and-take, a command-and-obey, a sense of love poured out and love received. God’s Spirit broods over the waters, God’s Word goes forth to produce new life, God’s Law guides his people, God’s Presence or Glory dwells with them in fiery cloud, in tabernacle and temple. These four ways of speaking moved to and fro from metaphor to trembling reality-claim and back again. They enabled Jews to speak simultaneously of God’s sovereign supremacy and his intimate presence, of his unapproachable holiness and his self-giving compassionate love.

Best known of all is perhaps a fifth. God’s Wisdom is his handmaid in creation, the firstborn of his works, his chief of staff, his delight. God’s Wisdom is another way of talking about God present with his people in the checkered careers of the patriarchs and particularly in the events of the Exodus. Wisdom becomes closely aligned thereby with Torah and Shekinah.[12] Through the Lady Wisdom of Proverbs 1-8, the creator has fashioned everything, especially the human race. To embrace Wisdom is therefore to discover the secret of being truly human, of reflecting God’s image.[13]............................Out of all this, I have argued in various places that we can, as historians, properly reconstruct Jesus of Nazareth’s sense of vocation. We can study John the Baptist’s vocation, and Paul’s: why should we not study Jesus’? When we do so, we find that dozens and dozens of lines of inquiry converge to produce a well ordered, coherent, historically credible sense of vocation, emerging in central symbolic actions, hinted at in a hundred cryptic and teasing sayings. Jesus believed he was Israel’s Messiah, the one in whom Israel’s history was to be summed up. Jesus believed he would win the messianic victory over the real enemy and would build the true messianic temple through taking Israel’s fate upon himself and going to the cross. Jesus believed that in doing so he was not just pointing to or talking about, but was actually embodying, the return of YHWH to Zion. These, though striking and startling, emerge from the world of Second Temple Judaism like the flower growing suddenly out of the plant. They were not expected, but upon inspection this is where they belonged. All the elements of the package were around somewhere in the culture. They are not, repeat not, a retrojection of later Christian theology, not even of later NT theology, which by and large developed in other legitimate ways. They are only credible, but they are totally credible, as the historically reconstructed mindset of Jesus himself. And they form, not the substance of later atonement and incarnational theology, but its historical starting point.

...............................



I have argued elsewhere that a central feature of Jewish expectation, and kingdom expectation at that, in Jesus’ time was the hope that YHWH would return in person to Zion. Having abandoned Jerusalem at the time of the exile, his return was delayed, but he would come back at last. Within this context, someone who told cryptic stories about a king or a master who went away, left his servants with tasks to perform, and then returned to see how they were getting on must—not “might,” must point to this controlling, over-arching metanarrative. Of course, the later Church, forgetting the first century Jewish context, read such stories as though they were originally about Jesus himself going away and then returning in a “second coming.” Of course, cautious scholars noticing this, deny that Jesus would have said such things. I propose that here at the heart of Jesus’ work, and at the moment of its climax, Jesus not only told stories about the king, who came back to Zion to judge and to save. He acted as though he thought the stories were coming true in what he himself was accomplishing. This is the context, at last, in which I think it best to approach the question with which this essay began.........................................And Jesus seems to have believed it about himself. The language was deeply coded, but the symbolic action was not. He was coming to Zion, doing what YHWH had promised to do. He explained his action with riddles all pointing in the same direction. Recognize this, and you start to see it all over the place, especially in parables and actions whose other layers have preoccupied us. Why, after all, does Jesus tell a story about a yearning father in order to account for his own behavior?[36] It is this that also accounts for his sovereign attitude to Torah, his speaking on behalf of Wisdom, and his announcement of forgiveness of sins.[37] By themselves none of these would be conclusive. Even if they are allowed to stand as words and actions of Jesus, they remain cryptic. But predicate them of the same young man who is then on his way to Jerusalem to confront the powers that be with the message and the action of the kingdom of God and who tells stories as he does which are best interpreted as stories of YHWH returning to Zion, then you have reached. I believe, the deep heart of Jesus’ own sense of vocation. He believed himself called to do and be what in the scriptures only Israel’s God did and was.

..................................What are we therefore saying about the earthly Jesus? In Jesus himself, I suggest we see the biblical portrait of YHWH come to life: the loving God, rolling up his sleeves (Isa 52:10) to do in person the job that no one else could do, the creator God giving new life the God who works through his created world and supremely through his human creatures, the faithful God dwelling in the midst of his people, the stern and tender God relentlessly opposed to all that destroys or distorts the good creation, and especially human beings, but recklessly loving all those in need and distress. “He shall feed his flock like a shepherd; he shall carry the lambs in his arms; and gently lead those that are with young” (Isa 40:11). It is the OT portrait of YHWH, but it fits Jesus like a glove. ...............
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Apparently you don't know shit about 'ZION'.
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http://mashiyach.com/

The Kingdom of Elohim is represented by Tsiyon (pronounced Tsee-yone or Zion in English), a literal place in Jerusalem, that symbolizes a spiritual place, the seat of Mashiyach's government on this earth. Originally Zion was a small location in Jerusalem, then it became a code name for the whole city of Jerusalem.



For it is said in the Scripture, “Behold, in Tsiyon I lay a chosen and precious stone for the head of the corner; and whoever believes in him will not be ashamed.” On you therefore who believe is this honor conferred: but to them who do not believe “he is a stone of stumbling and a rock of offense.” And they stumble at it because they believe not the Word from where they were appointed. But you are an elect race, officiating as priests of the Kingdom; a Set Apart people, a redeemed congregation; that you should proclaim the praises of him who called you out of darkness to his precious light: who formerly were not counted as a people but now are the people of Elohim; and also, there were (once) no mercies on you but now mercies are poured out upon you. My beloved, I entreat you as strangers and pilgrims, separate yourselves from all lusts of the body, for they war against the soul. And let your behavior be honorable before all men; so that they who utter evil speeches against you, may see your good actions and may praise Elohim in the day of trial. And be submissive to all the sons of men, for Elohim’s sake; to kings, on account of their authority; and to judges because they are sent by him for the punishment of offenders, and for the praise of them that do well. For so is the will of Elohim, that by your good deeds you may stop the mouth of the foolish who do not know Elohim: As free men, you are not like men who make their freedom a cloak for their wickedness, but as the servants of Elohim. 1 Peter 2:6-16




Throughout Scripture we read of a Kingdom that is not of this earth, but it is shaped from the pattern that is in Heaven. The tabernacle in the wilderness was built according to the specifications that YHWH gave to Moses and within that tabernacle, each of the physical elements are symbols of the spiritual or heavenly Kingdom. It is also interesting to note that Zion is mentioned in 153 verses in the Tanakh... this is the same number of fish the disciples caught in John 21:11. The symbolism is clear, Yeshua taught his disciples how to build the Kingdom of Heaven, as opposed to a religion "about" the Kingdom of Heaven, a very big difference.



We are being trained to know what Tsiyon is, and what it is not. No religion or people's groups have exclusive rights to Tsiyon, it belongs to the people of Mashiyach regardless of religion, race, color or creed. The Government of Tsiyon is on the shoulder of Mashiyach. Mashiyach is returning to the Mount of Olives from whence he departed, but this time round Scripture tells us he will be Mashiyach Ben David a much different scenario than when he first came to earth.



There is the Israel of Elohim (spiritual) and there is the other kingdom of Israel of the flesh. Not all who are Israel of the flesh are the Israel of Elohim. If we can look at Jews, Christians or Muslims without judging them by their religion or race, then we are getting closer to ZION, as how it is revealed in Mashiyach. The Kingdom of Elohim is a government, NOT a religion.



Tsiyon is also the place in our neshama (spirit) where we connect with Mashiyach where our heart receives and gives love for all of Creation, where we can see all others through the eyes of Mashiyach and carry no prejudice towards anyone. The Kingdom is within us, it is not an external government or religion.


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You're claim that Israel is an insignificant strip of sand illuminates your ignorance. Israel is the Left/Western Arm of the fertile Crescent..........the Israelites have even made the southern desert areas bloom due to hard work, a foreign concept to you. thumbs up

http://www.zionism-israel.com/

What is Zionism?
Zionism is the political movement that is implementing the national liberation of the Jewish people. It is based on the assertion that the Jewish people, like any other people, has the right to self-determination; Jews have a right to a national home in their historic homeland. Zionism has made a reality of the "impossible" project of restoration of the Jewish people to our homeland, after nearly 2,000 years of exile. The work of Zionism is far from complete, however.

Zionism has always been a part of Judaism
The ideological and cultural foundations of Zionism have always been present in Jewish tradition. Jews always thought of themselves as a nation or people. The concept of "am Yisrael" - the "people of Israel" or "nation of Israel," has been inherent in Jewish culture from ancient times. Jewish cultural and religious life always centered around the land of Israel. This did not change during two millennia of dispersion.




You're welcome in advance, thumbs up cheers wave


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Israel=Thje Promised Land!

Post  MoMo on Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:50 am

Israel=The Promised Land! thumbs up

Israel is the Promised Land, NOT Australia. thumbs up

http://www.vbm-torah.org/

http://www.vbm-torah.org/jewphi.htm



IN THE FOOTSTEPS OF THE KUZARI:
AN INTRODUCTION TO JEWISH PHILOSOPHY

by Prof. Shalom Rosenberg

50b: Sleeping Beauty, part 2



In Bereshit we read of the significant encounter between Avraham and Malkitzedek, king of Shalem. According to the biblical commentator Moshe David Cassuto, the Torah intends to convey "that Jerusalem was a holy city. [This was] an eternal holiness, extending since time immemorial, and even when it was populated by idol worshippers, who were accustomed to worshipping many gods, its inhabitants could not but worship their highest God," who is essentially identical to the one God of Scriptural monotheism.

Rashi gleans something else from this encounter. Our rights to the land are not the result of a divine promise accompanied by military conquest. Our Sages emphasized our "historical rights" to the land. Rashi describes how the children of Shem lived in the Land according to the original division among the sons of Noach, and how "the Canaanites were conquering the land of Israel from the children of Shem." On the background of this unjust conquest, which destroyed the original harmony between the peoples of the world, Avraham, a descendent of Shem, appears upon the stage of history. He meets with one of the last Shemite kings of Jerusalem, before they were destroyed by the Jebusites. This was Malkitzedek king of Shalem (Bereshit 14:18-20): "And Malkitzedek king of Shalem brought out bread and wine, and he was a priest of the highest God. And he blessed him and said, blessed is Avraham of the highest God, ruler of heaven and earth." In this encounter, the last remaining Shemite monotheistic priest meets Avraham and prophesies, "[God] will someday return [Jerusalem] to your children, who are the descendants of Shem" (Rashi, on Bereshit 12:6).

The Rambam teaches an additional unique aspect of Jerusalem. In his "Guide For The Perplexed" [3,45] he suggests that Jerusalem is referred to in the Bible as "the place which He will choose," without calling it explicitly by name, for political reasons. The name of the place was hidden so that "the nations would not hold onto it and fight a powerful war over it, as they would if they knew that this place on earth was the source of the Torah." Sadly, this attempt did not help, and the struggles over Jerusalem continue to this day. Political struggles have a mechanism of their own. In Jerusalem, a religious struggle exists as well.

The Jewish people return to their land with a demand for justice that is beyond law. No one disputes the spiritual ownership of other religions. This is one of the great tests of humanity. Will they recognize the rights of the father who has returned to life and to youth, to live in his own land?

Jerusalem was conquered by Christians and by Muslims. However, Jerusalem is holy to the Jews not because of an event that occurred in it, nor because of a building in it, but because of very essence. The Temple could burn down, foreign temples could be built in its place, and yet the connection with the land remains, as though nothing has changed. Thus, the Jewish people mourned over Jerusalem, and thus Rihal expressed the longing of Jerusalem for its people:

"Zion, will you not inquire after your prisoners who inquire after you, and are the remnant of your flock...
I cry endless tears to bewail your suffering, and when I dream of the return of your exiles, I am a violin for your songs."

Whoever has read Mark Twain's description of the parched land, so barren that he felt this could not possibly be the land of which the Bible speaks, understands what the renewal and rebirth of the land means.

The Ramban saw the double tragedy as the symbol of the deepest expression of the love between the people and the land. The nation could not rest peacefully in any other place in the world, and the land would not bear fruit for any foreign conqueror. It patiently awaited the return of its people.



IN THE FOOTSTEPS OF THE KUZARI:
AN INTRODUCTION TO JEWISH PHILOSOPHY

by Prof. Shalom Rosenberg


51a: The Land of Israel

The Paradox



We will now reopen our discussion of the uniqueness of the Land of Israel, the great paradox we have been living since the birth of Judaism in the first pages of the Scriptures. Before God there are no political or geographical boundaries, there are no boundaries of nations or of countries. And yet, the great message of this universalism is expressed in two particularisms, two uniquenesses: the uniqueness of the People and the uniqueness of the Land. The paradox teaches us that uniqueness is the path to universalism. The uniqueness of the Jewish people is part of a plan that will lead us and the nations of the world to the end of days, a plan for the redemption of the entire world. In this plan, the descendants of the Forefathers hold a unique place and position.

This paradox was a focal point of constant debate with many thinkers, particularly those who have stemmed from Judaism and have accepted some of the general principles of our Torah. The Scriptures proclaimed that Avraham would become the father of many nations.
And indeed, many nations have accepted the Torah of the Forefathers. However, many of them wished to accept these principles while erasing the name of the Jews. Sometimes this was done by actual killing of Jews, and generally it was done by stealing their identity, by claiming that they themselves are the true Jewish people.


Models
The paradox of uniqueness demands an explanation from within as well. Rihal uses biological and climatic models to explain his central thesis. In my opinion, the reader has a certain amount of freedom here. He can accept these explanations as they are, or he can suggest corrections that lift these explanations to a higher plane. Rihal attempts to analyze a difficult and central issue, but he lacks the tools for the job. He saw the biological and climatic theories as models to explain his reality. Thus, for example, Rihal used the fact that certain traits are present in the grandfather, disappear in the father and reappear in the third generation.

In this way, Rihal wished to convey the surprising idea that traits can reappear despite an apparent break in continuity and education: that there can be resurrection after surcease. What Rihal describes is a return to something that does not come from without but that already exists within. The biological model is wonderful, because it demonstrates that potential can exist, for example in genetic makeup, and not be expressed outwardly. The difference in genetics between a genotype and a phenotype is the difference between uniqueness and choseness. There are traits that remain hidden because of the environment in which the organism develops; however the genotype, the uniqueness, the inner potential, continues to exist. This description is true of the nation as well. This is the essence of the principle of eternal uniqueness in the philosophies of Rihal, the Maharal and Rav Kook.

Territory

This topic brings us to the place of territory in Jewish thought. We are better equipped, thank God, to discuss this question than previous generations, who read Rihal's philosophy regarding the land of Israel yet were severed from it. Here in the land of Israel we face the full significance of Rihal's writings on the subject, as well as the difficult dilemmas that the topic raises.

One can view the land of Israel as the place where the Jewish state resides. This is an instrumental view, in which territory becomes a vehicle. Like a house, a country is a place in which we live, and it constitutes, in the largest sense of the word, a vehicle, a tool necessary for our survival. This is a rational approach, and stands as one the principles of Zionism. This principle implies that Jewish existence in the Diaspora was abnormal and unhealthy, and that the nation must be healed and rehabilitated through Zionism. This can be compared to a cripple who has lost the use of his hands and legs, and who hopes for the return of their powers. The hands and legs represent the two central characteristics of political existence in an independent state. The hands represent the nation's ability to defend itself militarily, while the legs symbolize the connection to the territory. If we were to go in this direction we would reach the territorial basis necessary for the justification of the Zionist idea, and seemingly this would be enough. However, here we must learn the great lesson of the Kuzari.

Let us jump to the end of the book. At the end of the book, the Chaver bids farewell to the king and prepares to journey to the land of Israel. "After these events the Chaver decided to leave the land of the Khazars and journey to Jerusalem." The king is astonished:
"And the departure of the Chaver was difficult for the Kuzari and he spoke to him of it, saying, 'what is there to find in the land of Israel today, since the Holy Presence has left it? And since the closeness of God can be achieved in any location by a pure heart and a strong desire; and why should you place yourself at the peril of the deserts and the seas and the hatred of the various peoples?'" (5:22)

This question of the Kuzari king must amaze us. Since the very first discourse, Rihal has emphasized the significance of the Land of Israel. His journey to the Land of Israel is the necessary and logical result of all he has been saying and writing. If so, why is the Kuzari king surprised? The answer lies in the recognition of a paradox, which is expressed at the end of the book, and sheds a different light upon the entire book. The Chaver had built a Jewish state in the land of the Khazars! Not only that, but his place in that state is comparable to the role of the philosopher, who guides the king in his leadership of the ideal kingdom. We can understand the significance of this ideal state when we read the letter that Hasdai Ibn Shaprut wrote to the Kuzari king.

He writes:
"If there is a place where there is a beacon and a kingdom for the exiles of Israel and they are not tyrannized or controlled, and if I knew that this was true, I would despise my own honor and depart from my greatness and desert my family and would speedily go up mountains, over land or sea, until I would reach the place where my lord the king rules to see his greatness and his glory and the residence of his subjects and the superiority of his servants and the repose of the exiles of Israel. And upon seeing his greatness and glory, my eyes would alight and my innards rejoice and my lips would praise the One who had not withheld His bounty from my forlorn nation."

Hasdai Ibn Shaprut, the Jewish minister of the highest personal and political status in the Caliphate in Cordova, claims that he would abandon all of his honor and become a simple subject in the Jewish state in which the Jews have independence. This state has religious significance as well:
"For how can I bleed for the destruction of our glorious House and for the few saved from the sword who went through fire and water, who are but a small remainder and have lost our honor and dwell in exile, and God does not assist us against those who say to us all the day, 'every nation has a kingdom and you have no remembrance in the land.'"

And a Jewish state exists, the kingdom of the Khazars. However, Rihal instructs us through the paradox of his own life and choices. The Chaver abandons a Jewish state, nobility, independence and everything that goes along with it, in order to travel to a place that is under foreign rule. This place is the Land of Israel. Here we learn the great lesson. Our attitude towards the Land of Israel is not one of territory, in which, by chance, a Jewish state exists. We relate to it as our destiny, and view the encounter with it as part of our essence as Jews. Jewish sovereignty and independence are significant, but so is our relationship to the Land of Israel. At the end of the book we will learn how Rihal envisioned the ultimate return to the Land of Israel and the redemption. Herein lies the mystery and the paradox. The return to the Land of Israel is not a tool or a means. What we have here is here a relationship of encounter, a cosmic meeting of those intended for each other from the beginning of time. Just as it is written that every person's marriage partner is announced in Heaven forty days before his birth, so too it is announced that a particular field in the Land is intended for a particular person. Our Sages wished to teach us the romantic idea that the connection between a couple exists before they meet for the first time, and that their meeting is not a chance occurrence. So too the relationship between the People and the Land is more than a chance occurrence. The relationship was written in the books of destiny.
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IN THE FOOTSTEPS OF THE KUZARI:
AN INTRODUCTION TO JEWISH PHILOSOPHY

by Prof. Shalom Rosenberg

51b: The Land Of Israel, Part 2



What mysterious force lies behind the relationship of the People and the Land? What makes a particular union successful and unique? Here we enter into theories and models. Rihal attempts to describe it through a unique approach to the climate of the Land of Israel. We find a similar approach in the writings of Rambam. However, he limits the explanation, when he claims that this climate is not unique to the Land but characterizes the entire region. This is actually stated explicitly by Rihal:

"And Ever was the designated progeny of Shem...since his inheritance was the lands of comfortable climates, at the center of which is placed the coveted land, the land of Canaan, the land of prophecy." (1:95)

Thus, we find that the climatic condition is necessary but not sufficient. The Land of Israel is unique in that its climate integrates heat and cold. In other words, it unites the characteristics of those places lacking the conditions for creating a great civilization and a sophisticated culture. And indeed, both the inception and the development of civilization took place in the temperate climates.

Beyond the geographical conditions there is a mystical reality, a spiritual uniqueness of the Land, which makes it a place where prophecy can become a reality. The Land of Israel is the destined location of the ultimate encounter between the Jewish nation and God, the place destined for prophecy and redemption.

This approach to the Land of Israel perhaps can only be understood in categories of love. A person can consider a prospective mate according to the size of the dowry or other monetary interests, as a means to advance one's career or one's social status, etc. These are purely rational reasons. However, we all know that this is not enough, and justifiably so. Beyond these things we expect something more, something irrational and emotional, something we can only describe as love. The word love describes the relationship between the People and the Land. The book of Bereshit describes how the Great Matchmaker, the Creator himself, took Avraham, the father of the Jewish nation, and brought him to the Land of Israel. There he would found his nation, and there the great encounter between the Jewish people and God will ultimately take place. The encounter between the People and the Land is also a condition of redemption.

Thank God, for us no contradiction exists between the instrumental approach and what we might term the romantic approach. We must realize how fortunate we are, to live in the age where, after so much trial and suffering, these approaches finally merge. The distinction between the two approaches to the People and the Land was illustrated through a historical dilemma: Uganda or Palestine? The instrumental approach demanded searching for territory somewhere. This was called the territorial position. It was opposed by the position that spoke about the Land of Israel. Both approaches are important, and the Kuzari state and the other Jewish states that arose in the Diaspora were not a crime, but neither did they bring salvation. There were many Jews who did not think it a crime to live in the Diaspora but who considered the creation of a Jewish state in the Diaspora a betrayal of their allegiance to the Land of Israel.

These issues are important because of their current implications. We are faced with dilemmas that center around the ideals of the redemption of the People and of the Land. We will not enter into politics here. Politics means solving these dilemmas in a particular way. However, understanding the dilemmas is beyond politics. We must always be aware of the two-sidedness of our relationship to the Land. On the one hand, the instrumental relationship to a home, and on the other hand, the relationship to something that cannot be replaced. This relationship is represented in the Scriptures and in later literature by the classic image of the relationship to a mother. The Land is perceived as a mother to some individuals, and as a wife to the nation. We express this relationship through loyalty, love and respect.

The Land of Israel

As we have seen, the content of Jewish thought focuses around three central points: Creation, Revelation and Redemption. History is a process with many twists and turns; however, it ultimately leads us from Creation to Redemption through Revelation.

The Land of Israel symbolizes creation. The Land of Israel is also the land of prophecy.

The sacrifice of Yitzchak connects to the second point: Revelation. Just as Avraham was called to the Land of Israel from a foreign country, "Go ... to the land that I will show you" (Bereshit 12:1), so too he is called forth after entering the Land of Israel: "Go ... to one of the mountains that I will show you" (ibid. 22:2).

Here, too, Avraham follows the call to a place that he does not know, and only when he reaches it does God inform him that this is the place that God had destined for the great drama of the sacrifice of Isaac. Avraham's going reveals the holiness within the holiness. Avraham learned to recognize the holiness of the Land of Israel when he reached it. The holiness of Jerusalem had to be revealed much later, at the final trial.

The mount of the sacrifice, say the Scriptures, is the "mountain where God appeared," the place of revelation, the encounter with God. On this mountain the Temple will be built, the Temple in which man will encounter the Divine Presence. The Scriptures themselves are aware of the paradox in this claim. In king Shlomo's prayer in the Book of Melakhim we read,
"For can it be that God resides on the earth, behold the heavens and the highest firmaments cannot contain You, how can this House I have built [contain You]?" (Melakhim I, 8:27)

However, divine transcendence left room also for the immanence that is connected to "this place...and You will hearken from the heavens" (ibid. 8:29-32).

Revelation is expressed in two ways: in the personal encounter, and in the collective revelation of the Torah. Next to the Temple sat the Great Court, whose role was to teach Torah to the entire people of Israel.

The third point that is encompassed in Jerusalem is connected to the future: the Redemption. This idea means the triumph of good in the various circles of human activity: the national, the human-universal and the cosmic.


The national redemption is the return of the Jewish people to their Land. When the Jew prays for redemption, he prays to the God who "will rebuild Jerusalem," and adds, "may our eyes witness Your merciful return to Jerusalem. Blessed are You God, who will return His Presence to Zion." The redemption is the renewed meeting of the three: the People, the Land and the Divine Presence, the divine immanence.

Jerusalem is also the axle upon which the human-universal redemption turns as well. The mountain that was the center of spiritual heights for the Jewish people will become a center of inspiration and education for the entire world.



"And in the end of days the mount of the house of God will be placed above all mountains and rise above all hills and all the nations will swarm towards it. And many nations will go saying, come let us go up to the mountain of God, to the House of the God of Ya'akov, and He will teach us of His ways and we will follow in His paths, for Torah will go forth from Zion and the word of God from Jerusalem." (Yishayahu 2:2-3)

The particularism of the choosing of a People and a Land are thus merged with absolute universalism. The People and the Land preserved the Torah, so that it would spread among all the nations, and whose central expression is universal peace: "And they shall beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks, nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they study war any more" (ibid. 2:4).

In Jewish tradition, Jerusalem is also the center of the cosmic redemption. Yishayahu's vision, "and the wolf shall dwell with the lamb" (Yishayahu 11:6) is obviously an allegory for the ideal international relations that will reign in the messianic era. However, it is also a hint at a religious utopia, in which even the natural reality will change.

Various verses in Yechezkel hint at future changes in Jerusalem. A spring will gush from it, and from it powerful rivers will stream forth, which will even heal the Dead Sea. Clearly, these are references to the ancient Garden of Eden.

And indeed certain commentators have understood it in this way. According to their interpretation, the Garden that God planted in Eden underwent a catastrophic change as a result of the sin; however, with the advent of the redemption it will revert to its original state. The Garden of Eden is the Land of Israel, and its center is Jerusalem.

If this motif exists in the Scriptural tradition, then the symbolism of the Holy Temple can be understood in its light as well. At its center, as in the Garden of Eden, the Keruvim protected the Tree of Life, which is none other than the Torah - the word of God
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:52 am

The History in the Hebrew Bible was written in an alephbet BEFORE the Greeks had an Alphabet. thumbs up If you would actually bother to read it, it includes all Humankind and the whole world. As provided below. thumbs up

Check it out, see for yourself. If anyone would like to debate me, sign in. Lilly, the Queen of Bullshit ignores all the Archaeological, Linguistic and Historical evidence and just makes shit up. thumbs down

26And Elohim said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over the livestock, and over all the earth and over all the creeping creatures that creep on the earth.”

27And Elohim created the man in His image, in the image of Elohim He created him – male and female He created them.

28And Elohim blessed them, and Elohim said to them, “Bear fruit and increase, and fill the earth and subdue it, and rule over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over all creatures moving on the earth.”

29And Elohim said, “See, I have given you every plant that yields seed which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree whose fruit yields seed, to you it is for food.

30“And to every beast of the earth, and to every bird of the heavens, and to every creeping creature on the earth, in which there is life, every green plant is for food.” And it came to be so. 31And Elohim saw all that He had made, and see, it was very good




Tzelem Elokim=Humankind as Image of YHWH/God

1: Has Intelligence

2: Has Freewill

3: Has component of Spiritual Being-A Soul

4: HaShem/YHWH Rules the Universe and Spirit World, Humans have dominion over the Lower World.

5: Has the faculty of Judgement

6: Has an inherent Holiness and Dignity

As created in the image of God, humans are endowed with "three intrinsic dignities": infinite value, equality, and uniqueness.

The first means that human life cannot be weighed, measured, or compared in terms of, that is, subordinated to, any other value. In the Kantian Parlance humans are always a goal or end in themselves and never a means to something else.

The second term implies that no person or group is privileged over another. In fact, Idolatry results when a person or group absolutizes itself or its message.

The third idea reinforces the dignity of every human by insisting that each person is irreplaceable and has a special role to play in the redemption of the world.

The Jewish religion is founded on the divine assurance and human belief that the world will be perfected." Judaism engages with and seeks to overcome these realities of history through its notion of covenant. The covenant is that dynamic which God inaugurated in history, that partnership between God and the Jewish people, to achieve the dignities for which all humans were created. Jews are those teachers, models, and co-workers-having both a divine and human partners - whom God designated to help all persons and even nature achieve redemption. For Greenberg, the messianic dream of perfection will not be realized by divine fiat, but by "improving this world, one step at a time."

These understandings of God, humans, and the world are expressed through the Torah and lived-out by the Jewish people through the Holy days and the Halakhah. In this view, Torah is that divine teaching which stands as "the constitution of the ongoing relationship of God and the Jewish people." Rabbi Greenberg

This expanded view/articulation of higher values help us to search for YHWHs presence in the secular Realms of Life, some peeps call this: 'Holy Secularism'.

The Covenant is essentially a Divine, Loving, Pedagogic process. As Humans become more competent, YHWH invites them to take up a more active role in the Task of Tikkun Olam/World to Come, as Co-Creators.

The lay people of YHWH/God play a more influential role in discerning Yahwehs purpose and in carrying out His Divine Mandates.

Later, ensuing Historical events reshape understandings of earlier Teachings.

Summarized

We=ALL Living things-creatures-sustained and Nurtured by Yahweh-will fill the World with Life.

* We will reshape the Historical Reality, the Flesh & Blood world we inhabit, to sustain that Life at the highest possible level.

* Life will multiply and triumph Quantitatively over all its enemies; including Entropy, Death, and Disorder.

* Life will equally triumph Qualitatively.

* All of Lifes’ capacities/potentials will be developed fully and realized.

* When Life blossoms to its fullest capacity that treats all Life, especially Human Life-the most developed form-and sustains it with the highest and fullest respect that it deserves, then Life will be in harmony with existence and deeply related to Yahweh, its Source and Sustainer(Natural Laws)

* This is the Jews Story, and by default; the Christians/Xns.

* Telling the Story of Creation is the Jews 'Witness'. The present evidentiary Facts contradict the Narrative fairly substantialy.

* Yet, This Story of Creation is shared by Jews and Christians

* This Story leads Humans to see existence as best they can, from a Cosmic Perspective-Sub Specie Aeternitatis.

* From that Vantage Point there are Three Grand Movements in the unfolding Pattern of the Cosmos

1: The World is moving from Chaos to Order. From the Big Bang, with no Laws of Nature to the regularity of the Life sustaining Laws of Nature.

2: The World is moving from Non-Life to Life. From a State in which no life existed to the emergence of Life. From one cell, untold replications, life has grown Quantitatively, and developed Qualitatively. It has luxuriated and spread into a vast range of forms over and through a variety of sustaining conditions/environments.

* The declaration that Life is growing, moving from non-life to life is counter-intuitive.
Death & Entropy refute that contention.

The 'Key' is YHWH/God-The Hidden, Infinite Source of Life with limitless Goodness, Love and Power that sustains Life and Nurtures every possible Form of Life into Being.

* YHWH, the Divine Source evokes the Third Grand Movement of the Cosmos

3: Life is growing ever more to resemble its Ground: YHWH

Life moves from being less to becoming more and more like Yahweh. The highest form of Life, the Human Being, represents the High Point reached thus far.

In Human Form, life so resembles its Maker that it is called; Biblically; 'The Image of God'

* This emergence of "The Image of God" is the Turning Point in Cosmic History according to Jews & Christians.

Up to that point Life has been sworn to 'Be Fruitful & Multiply' (maximizing reproductive success) through a built-in control Programme-A 'Selfish Gene'- that drives the process.

* The 'Image of God' Consciousness is so much like YHWHs that Humans are able to 'grasp' this overall pattern of which we, ourselves are part, and to join voluntarily in its realization.

* Similarly, the Human 'Image of YHWH/God has a capacity to Love ALL their fellow creatures and every aspect of the Universe, as well as the Maker of it all and the Beauty of the Plan.

* Once Humans understand and embrace this understanding, they will lovingly identify with and willingly participate in the process of Perfection.

* YHWH has invited us, as Humans, The 'Image of God', to enter into a Covenantal Partnership, committed to Love, to join fully in perfecting the Universe.

Tikkun Olam

* The People of Israel joyfully acknowledge that YHWHs first Covenant, the Noahide Covenant, never superseded, is made with ALL Humanity, not exclusively with Jews and/or Christians alone.

* It is made with ALL Sentient Beings.

* ALL Beings are called to recognize and participate in Natures Patterns.

* To accept Limits.

* To Direct their choices and actions in favour of Life.

* To join in working for Order against Chaos.

* We are ALL CHOSEN to become part of the movement from Non-Life to Life.

* We are commanded to increase Life and make it grow ever more like its Maker.


* The purpose of the Religious way of life is to create the nurturing ambience of memory and experience, of relationships and actions that sustain Human growth and turns it towards Yahweh.

* Being in the 'Image of God/YHWH brings with it more God like capacities. It bestows intrinsic Dignity, a climatic extension of that respect to which all of life is entitled.

* The People of Israel hold these Truths to be self-evident: That ALL Humans are created in 'The Image of YHWH/God; and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable Rights, among which are:

* Infinite Value

* Equality

* Uniqueness.

These are Birthrights of every Son & Daughter of Yahweh

The Sinai Event was the ultimate Social Engineering event.
The Torah is the first, and oldest Religious Book written in an Alephbet/ Alphabet........this alters the hegemony of the Brain to being left hemispherical centric=Abstract, linear and sequential. the ground for Theoretical Science....



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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Tue Aug 09, 2011 12:28 pm

http://vbm-torah.org/archive/tehillim70/58tehillim.htm

Lecture 58: Psalm 122 – "Pray for the peace of Jerusalem" (Part I)





(1) A Song of Ascents of David.

1 I was glad when they said to me:

We are going to the house of the Lord.

(2) Our feet were standing

within your gates, O Jerusalem.

(3) Jerusalem that is built.

It is like a city that is united together.



2 (4) For the tribes went up there, the tribes of the Lord,

a testimony to Israel, to give thanks to the name of the Lord.

(5) For there they sat on thrones for judgment,

the thrones of the house of David.


3 (6) Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.

May they prosper who love you.

(7) May peace be within your walls,

prosperity within your palaces.

4 (Cool For my brothers' and companions' sakes

may I now say: Peace be within you.

(9) For the sake of the house of the Lord our God,

I will seek your good.



I was a still a youngster during the Six Day War. On the third day of the war, which fell out on Wednesday, 28 Iyar 5727, the shelling of Jerusalem abated and we left our bomb shelter and went home. During the afternoon, while listening to reports about the fighting coming from the old, massive radio in our house, the program suddenly stopped, and in a tremulous voice the broadcaster announced that the Old City of Jerusalem had been liberated. Twice, the broadcaster repeated the announcement, and silence fell upon our house.

Immediately following his announcement, the broadcaster read psalm 122 in the book of Tehillim: "Our feet were standing within your gates, O Jerusalem. Jerusalem that is built. It is like a city that is united together," and I was sure that the psalm had been specially written in the book of Tehillim for this exalted moment. This was followed by the playing of Naomi Shemer's "Jerusalem of Gold," which we had first heard three weeks earlier on the night following Yom Ha-Atzma'ut. It was clear to me that the song was composed in anticipation of the liberation of Jerusalem, in order to stir up yearnings in our heart for the city that had been taken captive and swallowed up by the Arab legions.



Rarely does a chapter of Scripture enjoy current significance as sharply as at that moment. This is the force of the psalms of Tehillim; even though they had been written for their own time and their own place, readers across the generations have found in them expressions of their own sentiments, even when these expressions do not accord with the plain meaning of the psalm.

In anticipation of 28 Iyar, Jerusalem Liberation Day, forty-three years following the event described above, I wish to return to psalm 122 in order to examine it for its own sake, to understand the plain meaning of its verses, to properly divide it into stanzas, to recognize its structure, and from all this, to grasp its unique message. But whether I want to or not, all of this literary analysis will perforce be carried out under the impressions left by the youthful experiences that I had along with the rest of the members of that generation.



I. WHAT IS THE CONNECTION BETWEEN DAVID AND THE SONGS SUNG BY THOSE ON A PILGRIMAGE TO THE HOUSE OF THE LORD?


A general question can be raised regarding our psalm: what is the historical-social reality that gave rise to it? Put differently, What are the circumstances in which or for which our psalm was composed?



This psalm is one of the few psalms in the book of Tehillim regarding which the body of the psalm seems to be ill-suited to its heading. The heading reads, "A Song of Ascents of David,"[1] whereas the body of the psalm describes a pilgrimage to the house of the Lord and the tribes going up to Jerusalem. As we all know, David did not build God's Temple, and thus in his time the tribes did not go up three times a year to the place that God chose. Moreover, the psalm describes Jerusalem as the place of "the thrones of the house of David," implying that the descendants of David were already sitting on the royal throne in Jerusalem.



This contradiction appears to underlie R. Yehoshua ben Levi's words in Makkot (10a):



R. Yehoshua ben Levi said: What is that which is written: "A Song of Ascents of David. I was glad when they said to me: We are going to the house of the Lord"? David said before the Holy One, blessed be He: Master of the universe, I have heard people saying, ‘When will this old man die, so that his son Shlomo will come and build the Temple and we will go on pilgrimage,’ and I was glad.



According to this, "I was glad" is David's reaction to the things he heard the members of his generation saying about him: "[When] will we be going to the house of the Lord?" Needless to say, this solution was proposed in a midrashic vein, and was never intended to account for the plain sense of the psalm.[2]



The solution adopted by many of the commentators trying to uncover the plain sense of the text is that David composed our psalm on behalf of future generations. But the question remains - for which generations?



1) The Radak and R. Yeshaya explain that "our psalm was recited by the members of the exile. Owing to their great yearning for the rebuilding of the Temple, they would mention Israel's festival pilgrimages and they would speak in the voice of their ancestors who lived during the period of the Temple" (wording of the Radak).



The Meiri (in one of his two explanations) offers a similar explanation - that "this psalm should be understood as referring to the members of the exile… He prophesies about the tidings of redemption, that when the time of redemption comes and the voice of salvation goes forth, the people's joy over the tidings will be great. And in order to magnify the superiority of the salvation, he speaks at length of the praises of Jerusalem, saying: 'Our feet were standing…,' That is, when you were in your fullness."[3]



Explanations of this sort, which understand the psalms in the book of Tehillim as prophecies uttered for the sake of the members of the exile, are very common in the commentaries of the Rishonim, and they stem from the desire to turn the book of Tehillim into one that expresses the sentiments of the Jewish people during the period in which these commentators lived. However, an examination of the text of the psalm reveals no hint whatsoever to the exile![4]



2) In our study of psalm 44,[5] we mentioned the view of R. Moshe Ha-Kohen Gikitila regarding the book of Tehillim, "that this book contains no prophecy about the future… all the psalms attributed to the sons of Korach were written by one of the singers descending from the children of Heman who were in Babylonia, for their words indicate exile."[6] These words conceal two assumptions that are exceptional in the traditional commentaries: a) the psalms of Tehilim that reflect historical events were written by poets who experienced these events and lived in the generations in which they occurred. b) The book of Tehilim includes psalms that were written the entire length of the biblical period, until the exile to Babylonia and the return from it. In order to support this view, R. Moshe makes great efforts to match the time implied by the contents of each of the psalms to the time of the author mentioned in the headings of those psalms.[7]



It is obvious, then, that R. Moshe could not accept the solution proposed by the commentators above, that David composed the psalm by way of prophecy regarding the distant future. How then did R. Moshe resolve the contradiction between the content of our psalm, which reflects a reality in which the Temple is standing, and the mention of David in its heading?



The Ibn Ezra, who often cites from R. Moshe's commentary (which was written in Arabic), quotes from it at the beginning of his own commentary to our psalm:



R. Moshe said that David composed this song so that it would be recited with the [other] songs in the house of God when it would be built.



He also agrees, then, that David composed this psalm so that it should be recited in the future – not for distant generations, the people living in exile or those living at the time of the Third Temple, but rather for the near generations, people living in David's own time who would merit to see the building of the Temple in the days of his son Shlomo.



R. Moshe's assumption frees him from having to attribute prophecy to David. Surely David knew from Natan the prophet that his son Shlomo would build the Temple. And just as David prepared the materials with which his son would build the Temple, as is described at length in Divrei Ha-yamim I 22, so too he prepared the songs that would be recited in the house of God after it was built.



3) The commentators whom we have brought thus far all assume that the mention of David's name in the psalm's heading testifies to the fact that he is the author of the psalm. It stands to reason that this is true about most of the psalms in the book of Tehillim whose headings include one or more names of people. There are, however, certain psalms regarding which it is more reasonable to assume that the heading contains a dedication of the psalm to the person mentioned therein. Thus, for example, the heading of psalm 127, "A Song of Ascents of Shlomo (li-Shelomo)," is understood by the Ibn Ezra as follows: "For Shlomo, like, 'And for Levi he said' (Devarim 33:Cool. This song was composed by one of the singers for Shlomo." The Radak proposes a similar explanation. The heading of psalm 72, "Li-Shlomo," was understood by the commentators in similar fashion - for Shlomo. Accordingly, it is not impossible that the heading "Le-David" should also sometimes be understood as "for David - in his honor."[8]



If we understand the psalm's heading in this manner, there is no reason to attribute our psalm to a period during which the Temple was not standing, neither to the period of David nor to the period of the exile. Our psalm very clearly reflects the experience of making a pilgrimage to Jerusalem, and it is therefore reasonable to assume that its author participated in this uplifting experience.[9] And how appropriate it is that this unknown psalmist should have dedicated his song to David! It was David who dedicated his life to the construction of the Temple,[10] and it was he who established a dynasty of kings who ruled generation after generation – "the thrones of the house of David."[11]



In any event, it may be argued that our psalm is the song of pilgrims to Jerusalem who went up to the house of God. And indeed, during the Second Temple period, pilgrims to Jerusalem recited the verses of our psalm, as will be demonstrated below.



II. THE SONG OF PILGRIMS


The only description of pilgrimages to Jerusalem during the Second Temple period that has been preserved in rabbinic literature – in the Mishna, the Tosefta and the Jerusalem Talmud – relates not to pilgrimages made on the three pilgrim festivals, but rather to pilgrimages to Jerusalem undertaken by those bringing bikkurim (first-fruit) to the city. It is clear from the account in tractate Bikkurim that the people bringing bikkurim from an entire district – "ma'amad" – would assemble together in order to bring the bikkurim as part of a large contingent:



How were the bikkurim taken up [to Jerusalem]? All [the inhabitants of] the cities that constituted the ma'amad assembled in the city of the ma'amad, and spent the night in the open place thereof… Early in the morning, the officer said: "Let us arise and go up to Zion, into the house of the Lord our God" (Yirmiyahu 31:5).[12]

Those who lived near brought fresh figs and grapes, but those from a distance brought dried figs and raisins. An ox with horns bedecked with gold and with an olive-crown on its head led the way. The flute was played before them until they were near to Jerusalem.

And when they arrived close to Jerusalem they sent messengers in advance[13] and ornamentally arrayed their bikkurim. The governors and chiefs and treasurers [of the Temple] went out to meet them. According to the rank of the entrants they would go forth. All the skilled artisans of Jerusalem would stand up before them and greet them: "Brethren, men of such and such a place, we are delighted to welcome you."

The flute was playing before them till they reached the Temple Mount; and when they reached the Temple Mount, even King Aggripas would take the basket and place it on his shoulders and walk as far as the Temple courtyard. At the approach to the courtyard, the Levites would sing the song: "I will extol You, O Lord, for You have raised me up; and have not suffered my enemies to rejoice over me." (Bikkurim 3:2-4)



The Yerushalmi (Bikkurim 3:2) brings a baraita that completes the description of the pilgrimage found in the mishna:



On the road they would say: "I was glad when they said to me: We are going to the house of the Lord." In Jerusalem they would say: "Our feet were standing within your gates, O Jerusalem.”



It stands to reason that the words "they would say" in this baraita do not mean that they would say this once as a proclamation, but rather that they would recite these verses over and over whenever they set off on their journey, and similarly when they arrived in Jerusalem.[14]



Of course, the mishna's description of the pilgrimage made by those bearing their bikkurim also fits the pilgrimage made on the three pilgrim festivals. Does the continuation found in the baraita brought in the Yerushalmi also fit the pilgrim festivals? Here there is room for doubt.



The mitzva of making a pilgrimage on the pilgrim festivals falls on each and every individual. But owing to the fact that all the pilgrims fulfilled their obligations on the same date, it stands to reason that they did so in great numbers as part of a mass pilgrimage.



The mitzva of bringing bikkurim to the Temple – "And you shall put it in a basket, and shall go to the place which the Lord your God shall choose to place His name there" (Devarim 26:2) – is also a mitzva that falls upon each and every individual who farms his land. There is, however, no single date on which to fulfill this mitzva: "From Atzeret [Shavuot] to the festival [Sukkot], he brings and recites [the obligatory passage]" (Bikkurim 1:6). Accordingly, each person could bring his bikkurim on a day that suited him and his produce.



Nevertheless, we see from the mishna that the bikkurim were brought to the Temple in the context of a large congregation. As opposed to the pilgrimages on the festivals, the pilgrimages of those bringing their bikkurim did not take place all at the same time from all parts of Eretz Yisrael, but rather each district would go up to Jerusalem at a different time. Upon what did the date of the pilgrimage depend? Upon the climatic and agricultural character of each different district. Eretz Yisrael is a land of mountains and valleys, and the growing place of various different kinds of produce. Dates grow in its valleys and other fruit of the seven species grow on its mountains. Some mountains grow grapes, others olives. The different climates in the various parts of the land also cause the same fruits to ripen at different times. Each district, depending upon its geographical-climatic and agricultural character, set its own time for bringing bikkurim in accordance with its climate and special produce.[15]



How did the farmers of a particular region know that it was time for them to assemble together in order to bring their first-fruit to the Temple? This question does not arise regarding the pilgrimages to Jerusalem on the three pilgrim festivals: there each person knew the date on which to leave his house in order to arrive in Jerusalem before the festival, and convoys of pilgrims would form in a most natural manner. But in the case of bikkurim, there was no fixed date each year!



It stands to reason that each year the elders of the region would set a date for assembling together for the purpose of going up to Jerusalem based on the special factors regarding the ripening of the fruits in that area, and messengers would inform all the farmers that on a particular day, all should assemble in "the city of the ma'amad."



Indeed, our psalm opens with the call:



I was glad when they said to me:

We are going to the house of the Lord.



Only those going up to Jerusalem with their bikkurim required that "they should say to them" that they were going up to the house of the Lord! The pilgrims going up to Jerusalem for the three pilgrim festivals did not need such a call, for they knew on their own when to set out.



It is possible, then, that our psalm is the psalm of those going up to Jerusalem with their bikkurim, the verses of which were recited on their way to and when they arrived in the city, as is described in the baraita in the Yerushalmi.[16]



(To be continued.)



(Translated by David Strauss)




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[1] And similarly in the headings of the Songs of Ascent 124, 131 and 133. The heading of Song of Ascents 127 reads, "A Song of Ascents of Shlomo."

[2] Rashi cites this derasha in his commentary to verse 1.

The Meiri makes an interesting attempt to explain the psalm in accordance with its plain sense as describing an event in David's life:

If we explain it as referring to David himself, this is the explanation: When David said to Natan the prophet, "See now, I dwell in a house of cedar, but the ark of God dwells within curtain," and Natan answered him, "Go, do all that is in your heart, for the Lord is with you" (see Shmuel II 7 and Divrei Ha-yamim I 17), before he received the prophecy, "You shall not build the house" - he said: "I was glad when they said to me, We are going to the house of the Lord." That is to say: Regarding what Natan said to me, "Do all that is in your heart." I was sure that I would build it, and that "our feet would be standing within your gates," and the word "hayu" is a past tense ("were") that serves as a future tense ("would be"), and that it would be built and the tribes would go up there and they would sit on the thrones of justice – all past tense serving as a future tense.

But when he saw that his hopes would not be fulfilled, he said his words (beginning with verse 6) as one who yearns and laments about his inability to realize his desire. And he stirred his contemporaries, since he did not merit to build the Temple, neither him, nor them, his people, that they should bless it and pray to God for its peace and the peace of those who love it.

This explanation also does not accord with the plain sense of the psalm, and the Meiri would never have dreamed of suggesting it as an explanation of the body of the psalm, had he not been forced to do so by the psalm's heading.

[3] The difference between the Meiri and the two earlier commentators is that they explained the psalm as a song of yearning for Jerusalem, uttered in the sorrow of exile, whereas the Meiri seems to recognize that there is not the slightest hint of sorrow hanging over the psalmist. He therefore attributes the psalm to those in the exile who will utter it when they hear the tidings of redemption. Mentioning the praises of Jerusalem when it was at its height serves as psychological preparation for the rebuilding of Jerusalem in the near future. See below note 4c.

[4] a. What made it easier for these commentators to attribute our psalm to the people in exile is the contradiction between the heading, which attributes the psalm to David, and the body of the psalm, which clearly describes a period that does not accord with that of David. Thus, we are forced to adopt the accepted resolution that David spoke of the future by way of the holy spirit. This being the case, it is possible to push off this future to the period of the exile.

b. It should be noted that the Radak's explanation of our psalm follows from his understanding of all the Songs of Ascent as "songs uttered as if by the people in exile" (see beginning of psalm 120).

c. The Ibn Ezra brings an explanation that pushes off even further the future to which our psalm is referring: "There are those who say [that David uttered our psalm] with respect to the Third Temple." According to this explanation, we have here not a description of Jerusalem in the past, but rather a description of Jerusalem in the present, but this present is the prophetic present: the present of the people of the Third Temple period, in whose mouths David put his words by way of the holy spirit. This explanation does not follow at all from the body of the psalm, but solely from the contradiction between the heading and the body.

[5] Section VII, especially notes 1, 2 and 5.

[6] The citation is from the Ibn Ezra's introduction to the book of Tehillim. R. Moshe's name is not mentioned there, but it is clear that the Ibn Ezra is referring to him. See at length in U. Simon, Arba Gishot Le-Sefer Tehilim (Bar Ilan, 5742).

[7] This leads him to the conclusion that some of the people mentioned in the headings lived during the period of the exile, and not, as is generally accepted, in the generation of David. See his comments cited earlier regarding the sons of Korach.

[8] There is, however, a difference between the heading "Li-Shlomo" and what we are saying about the heading of our psalm: There, the commentators propose that the psalm was composed [by David or one of the other psalmists] for Shlomo in order to educate him or to bless him, whereas here we are suggesting that our psalm was composed in honor of David following his death. The common denominator between all these explanations is that the letter lamed that precedes a name can be understood as "for" (compare to the heading of psalm 92: "A psalm, a poem for the Sabbath day").

[9] It is difficult to attribute such an authentic account of the experience of going up to Jerusalem to someone who never experienced it, and not even to David, as was proposed by R. Moshe Ha-Kohen. This problem is not as striking in the Radak's explanation, for he understands our psalm as a song of yearning for Jerusalem on the part of the people in exile: they give expression to the concrete experience of making a pilgrimage that either they or their parents had during the time of the Temple.

[10] See psalm 132.

[11] As Brill says in his commentary: "Le-David – this means: for David, who conquered the city of Jerusalem from the hands of the Yevusi, built it, established his throne in it, and caused the ark of the covenant to rest there."

[12] The officer's call brings to mind the words of the "sayers" in our psalm: "We are going to the house of the Lord."

[13] Their stopping in this place brings to mind what is stated in our psalm: "Our feet were standing within your gates, O Jerusalem."

[14] a. It is twice mentioned in the mishnayot cited above that "the flute was played before them:" both when the people were on the way to Jerusalem and when they were in the city on the way to the Temple Mount. It stands to reason that they advanced singing and playing musical instruments.

b. It is difficult to conclude from the account in the Yerushalmi whether they would only sing these two verses from our psalm, or perhaps they would also sing the rest of the psalm after entering the city.

[15] a. Thus we learn (Bikkurim 1:3): "Bikkurim are not brought… from dates grown on hills [where they do not grow well], or from valley-fruits [from fruit that does not grow well in valleys]… that are not of the best kind." The farmers in each region brought the fruits that their region excelled in.

b. The significance of the fact that the Sages turned the mitzva of bikkurim, which falls upon each individual, into a mitzva that is fulfilled in the framework of a mass of people is explained in my study of Parashat Ki-Tavo (1st series), pp. 294-295. Our comments above regarding the pilgrimages and psalm 122 were taken from that study.

[16] As stated above, these ideas appeared earlier in my study of Parashat Ki-Tavo. When I included these ideas in the present study, I saw that similar ideas were alluded to by R. Yehuda Shaviv in his book, "Yesod Ha-Ma'ala – Iyunim Be-Shirei Ha-Ma'alot Bi-Tehillim," p. 54
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Tue Aug 09, 2011 12:31 pm

Lecture 60: Psalm 122 – "Pray for the peace of Jerusalem" (Part III)





(1) A Song of Ascents of David.

1 I was glad when they said to me:

We are going to the house of the Lord.

(2) Our feet were standing

within your gates, O Jerusalem.

(3) Jerusalem that is built.

It is like a city that is united together.



2 (4) For the tribes went up there, the tribes of the Lord,

a statute in Israel, to give thanks to the name of the Lord.

(5) For there sat thrones for judgment,

the thrones of the house of David.



3 (6) Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.

May they prosper who love you.

(7) May peace be within your walls,

prosperity within your palaces.



4 (Cool For my brothers' and companions' sakes

may I now say: Peace be within you.

(9) For the sake of the house of the Lord our God,

I will seek your good.



V. THE MEETING OF THE PEOPLE AND THE CITY


In section III of our analysis, we explained the structure of our psalm. The psalm is divided, based on stylistic considerations, into four stanzas. We demonstrated there that stanza 1 is characterized by the linking connection between its three lines, whereas stanzas 2-4 are characterized by the striking doubling in the two lines of each stanza. The doubling in stanzas 2 and 4 create a parallelism between the two lines, whereas in stanza 3 the doubling is based on a repetition of two words in a fixed place in each line. We raised the question: Does the doubling that characterizes stanzas 2-4 serve to express a particular idea, and is there a common denominator shared by these stanzas?



As in section III, here too we shall begin our discussion with stanzas 2-4, and only afterwards shall we turn to stanza 1, which is different from them.



Let us examine stanza 2. Its two lines demonstrate parallelism, as was described in section III.[1] Is this synonymous parallelism?[2] The answer seems to be affirmative; in both lines, a description is given of something that is taking place "there" – in Jerusalem. The parallelism follows from the fact that the event described in each of the lines is presented in similar grammatical order and from similar linguistic phenomena in the two lines. Here is the formula upon which the two lines are built:



The word "sham" ("there") used in reference to Jerusalem / a past tense plural verb ("alu" ["went up"], "yashvu" ["sat"])/ a noun serving as the subject of the clause and appearing twice ("shevatim" – "shivtei" ["tribes"], "kis'ot" – "kis'ot" [throne]).



It is, however, difficult to describe this parallelism as synonymous. The subjects of the two lines, "the tribes of the Lord" and "the thrones of the house of David," are very different one from the other, and it is difficult to perceive the connection between them. Similarly, the parallel verbs are very different from each other (“went up” and “sat”), corresponding to the difference between the subjects. The verb "went up" denotes movement and dynamism, whereas the verb "sat" expresses motionlessness and being at rest. It may be argued that the parallelism between these two verbs is contrasting.



What underlies the differences between these two lines? It seems that the first line describes the people going up to Jerusalem, whereas the second line describes the city itself. The people going up "there" is comprised of people in motion; hence the dynamism characterizing the first line.[3] The city, on the other hand, is a static element by its very nature; the "thrones" within it "sit" and wait for the people to appear before them for judgment.



The desire to create a contrast between the dynamic element and the static element explains the psalmist's seemingly surprising decision to describe the kings of the house of David by way of the noun "thrones." "Throne" is a metonym for "king."[4] Why doesn't the psalmist simply say, "for there ruled the kings of the house of David"? The answer is that in order to sharpen the contrast between the dynamic element (the people) and the static element (the city), he chooses to describe the kingdom by way of an object that symbolizes it, and the verb connected to the kingdom by way of the static verb "sat."



What, then, is the second stanza's guiding idea in its entirety? This stanza wishes to describe the encounter between the people and the city, between the dynamic element and the static element. The stanza achieves this by way of two lines standing in partial contrasting parallelism to each other.



This explains something else as well. Why does the psalmist choose to emphasize specifically "the sitting for judgment" of the Davidic kings from among all the other functions of the monarchy? The answer to this question is that the judicial function of the kings is what serves as the meeting ground between them – who sit on the thrones for judgment – and the people who go up to be judged before them.[5]



Let us move on to stanza 3: Will the distinction between the two lines of stanza 2 help us here as well? Indeed, it will. The fundamental difference between the first and second lines in this stanza is to whom the speaker's words are directed. In the first line, he addresses his fellow pilgrims entering the gates of Jerusalem along with him as they go up to the house of the Lord; in the second line, the call (his or theirs) is to the city of Jerusalem. The call to the pilgrims uses a dynamic verb, "sha'alu" ("pray"); the call to the city contains the static verb "yehi" ("may it be").



While it is true that the speaker turns to Jerusalem already in the second clause of the first line, the subject of what he says to it is "they who love you" – those pilgrims to whom his first words were directed.[6] It turns out, then, that when the speaker speaks about Jerusalem, he directs his words towards his fellow pilgrims, and when he speaks to Jerusalem, the contents of his request relate to his fellows.



Not only does the second line of the stanza deal with the city, but it specifies two of its parts – its walls and its palaces. We have here the clearest expression of the city's static dimension (even more so than the "thrones" in the previous stanza).



It turns out, then, that the twofold verbal parallelism between the two lines of this stanza comes to illustrate the different context in which each of the repeating words is found:



Pray for the peace – directed at the pilgrims, dynamic verb

May peace be – directed at Jerusalem, static verb



May they prosper who love you – the root shin-lamed-heh (verb), relating to the pilgrims

prosperity within your palaces – the root shin-lamed-heh (noun), relating to the palaces of Jerusalem



Stanza 3, even more than stanza 2, expresses the meeting between the people and the city. In stanza 2, the lines parallel each other, but each line stands on its own. In stanza 3, on the other hand, there is continuity between the two verses (and therefore they are not parallel): the call to the people in the first line yields its fruit in the second line, with the people turning to Jerusalem.



The intimate meeting of the people and the city in stanza 3 finds expression not only in the verbal repetition, but also in the alliteration that connects the four clauses in the stanza: the letters shin and lamed, which characterize the name Jerusalem (Yerushalayim), repeat themselves together six times in the four clauses:



Pray (sha'alu) for the peace (shelom) of Jerusalem (Yerushalayim).

May they prosper (yishlayu) who love you.

May peace (shalom) be within your walls,

prosperity (shalva) within your palaces.



This stanza constitutes in its entirety an interpretation of the name of Jerusalem. The peace and prosperity of the city spread from the static city to the people who are engaged in a dynamic process of ascent to and meeting with the city.



Stanza 4 is entirely a call of the speaker of the psalm to Jerusalem. Is it then possible to find in the lines of this stanza the distinction that we found in the previous stanzas? The distinction here is simple and prominent. In each of the lines, the speaker wishes good things for Jerusalem, and the parallelism is synonymous: "May I now say: Peace be within you" / "I will seek your good." But the objectives of these petitions are very different. In the first line: "For my brothers' and companions' sakes," i.e., the pilgrims with whom the speaker came to Jerusalem;[7] in the second line, "For the sake of the house of the Lord our God," the house which is situated in the midst of Jerusalem and which constitutes the objective of their pilgrimage ("We are going to the house of the Lord").



Once again we find a meeting between the dynamic element – the people making pilgrimage to Jerusalem, and the static element – the house of the Lord. The good of Jerusalem, for which the speaker prays, flows abundantly both on the nation that visits the city and on the house of God concealed within it.



Let us now return to stanza 1, which differs in its nature from the stanzas that follow. Because of this difference, is it also different substantively? Does the distinction that we found in stanzas 2-4 between the people and the city, between the dynamic element and the static one, exist in stanza 1 as well?



It does not take very much effort to see that this stanza is also divided between these two elements. The opening line and the first half of the second line describe the pilgrims on their journey until they reach the city; the second half of the second line and the third line are devoted to the city and its appearance.



Stanza 1 also describes the meeting between the people and the city, but in this stanza this encounter is not an established fact as it is in the other stanzas; rather, the encounter is created in it. At the beginning of the stanza, the pilgrims are still in their own towns far from Jerusalem, and the movement toward Jerusalem is just beginning. But in the heart of the stanza, in its second line, we come to the initial and moving encounter between them:



Our feet were standing

within your gates, O Jerusalem.



We have found, then, the common denominator between all four stanzas in the psalm, and this is what determines the structure of each of the stanzas and the theme of the entire psalm - the meeting between the people and the city of Jerusalem. The theme of the psalm is neither the city of Jerusalem in itself, nor the pilgrims who visit it, but rather the encounter between them.



The name of God appears three times in the psalm, and one more time in abridged form, "Y-ah." In the psalm's frame, that is, in its first and last line, we find the expression, "the house of the Lord" or "the house of the Lord our God." The house of God drives the entire "plot" of the psalm and serves as its starting point, but it is also the end of all the wishes and blessings – "For the sake of the house of the Lord our God…"



In the body of the psalm, the name of God appears twice, both times in the first line of stanza 2, which is dedicated to the people going up to Jerusalem. The tribes are called "the tribes of the Lord," and the purpose of their pilgrimage to Jerusalem is "to give thanks to the name of the Lord."



It turns out, then, that the name of God rests upon the two elements comprising the psalm – the static element, the house of God, and the dynamic element, the tribes of God, the tribes of Israel going up to Jerusalem.



Other psalms in the book of Tehillim deal with Jerusalem, the house of God, and pilgrimages. Psalms 42-43 and 84 describe the yearnings for the house of God, recall past pilgrimages, and express hope to merit pilgrimages in the future. Psalms 48 and 87 deal with the city of Jerusalem in itself, but do not mention the pilgrimages made to it.



Our psalm is unique in that it sings the praises of Jerusalem in relation to the experiences of the pilgrims when they encounter the city.



VI. THE COURSE OF THE PSALM


What is left for us to do now is to describe the course of the psalm – the progress made from one stanza to the next in such a manner that creates continuity and development.



The role of stanza 1, as stated above, is to create the very encounter between the pilgrims and Jerusalem. In its first line, the opening line of the whole psalm, the pilgrims are still in their hometowns, far from Jerusalem. The physical distance is bridged by the joyous heart that yearns to go up to the house of God. Jerusalem is, indeed, far off, but it draws to it those who love it with magnetic force.



In order to illustrate this magnetic attraction, there is a jump between the first and second lines: The psalmist did not yet describe his actual going to Jerusalem, after hearing those who said to him, "We are going to the house of the Lord," and already, "Our feet were standing within your gates, O Jerusalem." Our psalm is indeed a psalm of pilgrims, but it is not the pilgrimage experience upon which it focuses. A description of the pilgrimage itself can be found in verses in psalms 42-43 and 84.[8] Our psalm is dedicated to the experience of the pilgrims' encounter with Jerusalem, and therefore the psalmist hurries to describe this encounter already in the second line, "Our feet were standing within your gates" – intentionally skipping over an account of the journey itself.



The emotional force of the encounter expresses itself in the choice of grammatical persons in stanza 1. The pilgrims to Jerusalem speak of themselves in first person singular or plural, and they address Jerusalem in second person feminine – "within your gates, O Jerusalem." This addressing of Jerusalem in second person feminine continues until the end of the psalm (with the exception of stanza 2, the peculiarity of which will be discussed below). On the face of it, there is novelty here. The prophets of Israel oftentimes liken Zion and Jerusalem to a woman, and similarly they frequently address it in second person.[9] Nevertheless, our psalm is different than those prophecies. In the words of the prophets, Zion and Jerusalem are names given to an abstract entity that embraces the people and the land, the kingdom, and perhaps also the city itself. Our psalm is unique in that the concrete city of Jerusalem, with its gates and buildings, its wall and its palaces, stands before the psalmist in all its materiality while he stands at its gates, and he addresses the real city as if it were a woman![10] The poet Yitzchak Shelav wrote his poem "Ke-Ish Ha-Medaber Be-Isha" under the influence of our psalm and psalm 87:



Like a man who speaks of a woman, I shall speak of you,[11] the city,

Things glorious,[12] precious and soft.

I shall utter words that are

Better than caresses and warmer than kisses.[13]



In stanza 2, there is a stylistic "retreat" from the intimacy expressed in the previous stanza through the use of the first and second grammatical persons. In this stanza, both the pilgrims to Jerusalem – "the tribes of the Lord" – and the city itself (with the thrones of the house of David that are found in it) are referred to in third person:



For the tribes went up there…

For there sat thrones for judgment…



What is more, even the name of Jerusalem is replaced by the term "there" (sham – shama). What is the meaning of this change?



It seems that this can be understood as follows. When the psalmist stands at the gates of Jerusalem and when he sees the city spread out before him in all its beauty, words reflecting the deep impression it has upon him escape from his mouth: "Jerusalem that is built. It is like a city that is united together." However, as he stands in that very same place, the psalmist contemplates the fact that Jerusalem is not only the city that reveals itself before him in the here and now. In a moment of reflection, he considers the role of Jerusalem in the life of the people, not only at this particular time, but at all times. A more restrained style is appropriate for reflection of such sort, a style that lacks the previous excitement of the "man who speaks to a woman."[14]



Jerusalem fills two main roles in the life of Israel. It constitutes a center for pilgrimage, based on the law that three times a year the tribes of Israel must go up to the place that God will choose. This is the "religious" role of the city, connected primarily to the house of God that is situated within it.



Jerusalem, however, has another role - it is a royal city, the seat of the kingdom of the house of David – the site of government and justice.[15]



Just as stanzas 1-2 constitute a pair in that they reflect two aspects of Jerusalem in relation to those standing at its gates, the manifest Jerusalem (stanza 1) and the concealed Jerusalem (stanza 2), so too stanzas 3-4 constitute a pair.



Stanzas 3-4 share both the same content and the same style. From a substantive perspective, the two stanzas contain blessings and wishes for Jerusalem. From a stylistic perspective, they are connected by the word "peace," which appears twice in stanza 3 and a third time in stanza 4. So too in both stanzas, Jerusalem is addressed in the second person feminine (as in stanza 1).



What is the place of these stanzas in the narrative framework of our psalm which describes a pilgrimage to Jerusalem? It seems that stanzas 3-4 reflect a more advanced stage of the encounter with Jerusalem. In stanzas 1-2, the feet of the pilgrims stand at the gates of Jerusalem; in stanzas 3-4, there are allusions to the fact that they have already entered the city. This is a reasonable conclusion from the pilgrims' blessing to Jerusalem, "May peace be within your walls, prosperity within your palaces." The direction indicated in this blessing is from the outside inwards – from the walls encompassing the city to the palaces inside. In the last stanza, the allusion goes even further: mention of "the house of the Lord our God" suggests that the pilgrims have already reached the house of God, the goal of their journey in stanza 1. It is possible then that stanzas 3-4 reflect the pilgrims' entry into Jerusalem and their arrival at the Temple.[16]



We have already offered a basic explanation of stanzas 3-4 in section IV. Let us add here the following: Our psalm opened in first person singular, "I was glad when they said to me," and immediately shifted into first person plural, "We are going," "our feet were standing." It might seem that at this stage, the individual will be swallowed up among the mass of pilgrims which he has joined and that his voice will not be heard again. But the truth is that this is not the case.



Already in stanza 3, the individual sounds his voice, only that is only by implication; it seems that it is he who calls to his fellow pilgrims, "Pray for the peace of Jerusalem," and he who then turns to Jerusalem and petitions, "May they prosper who love you." In this way, the speaker serves as sort of a go-between between his fellow pilgrims and the city that is so dear to him; he asks them to pray for the city's peace, and he petitions the city that it reward them and bestow prosperity upon them. The role of the individual speaker in this stanza and the role of his fellow pilgrims is the very opposite of their roles in stanza 1. There, it is they who say to him, "We are going to the house of the Lord," and he gladly goes with them, whereas here he calls to them, "Pray…," and they join him and bless Jerusalem, "May peace be within your walls."



In stanza 4, the individual returns and speaks his words by himself the entire length of the stanza: "For my brothers' and companions' sakes may I now say… I will seek your good." The reason for this is that the target of his words in this stanza, with which he addresses Jerusalem, is "for my brothers' and companions' sake" – his fellow pilgrims to Jerusalem. Since he wishes to bless them through Jerusalem, he must distinguish himself from them. Does the community of pilgrims then disappear in this last stanza? Not necessarily. The connection between the masses of pilgrims and the individual speaker is expressed here in the words, "For the sake of the house of the Lord our God."



Thus, it turns out that across the psalm we hear many different voices - the voice of the "I" and of the "we," the voice of "they" and of the plural "you" - and all these voices turn to the singular "you" – Jerusalem.



(Translated by David Strauss)




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[1] We used this parallelism in section IV to establish that "the thrones of judgment" and "the thrones of the house of David" represent the very same thing, the monarchal rule of the house of David, the members of which also serve in a judicial capacity.

[2] "Synonymous parallelism" is parallelism in which the two clauses express similar content, as opposed to "contrasting parallelism."

[3] This dynamism finds expression not only in the verb "went up," but also in the last words in this line, which have no parallel in the second line – "to give thanks to the name of the Lord." Not only is the going up a dynamic act, but its goal of "giving thanks" is as well.

[4] a. Metonymy is a figure of speech in which a word or phrase is substituted for another with which it is closely associated in actuality or conceptually.

b. "Sitting on a throne" (Melakhim I 1:13 and other verses there) is also a metonym for the act of ascending to the kingship.

c. Calling rulers by the name of some object that symbolizes their rule is very common in all languages. "Pharaoh" in Egyptian means "great house;" the president of the United States is referred to as "the White House;" the pope is called "the Holy See."

[5] a. This encounter is finely described in Shmuel II 15:2: "And when any man that had a controversy came to the king for judgment… of the tribes of Israel." Usually the judge is described as sitting in a fixed place, with those who need his judgment coming to him. See, for example, Shoftim 4:4-5.

b. The parallelism between the two lines of stanza 2 adds meaning to the description of the pilgrimage of the tribes in the first line. They go up "there" – to Jerusalem - not only "to give thanks to the name of the Lord," but also to stand before the king for judgment regarding any quarrel that they might have with others. But this pilgrimage is a pilgrimage of individuals, and not associated specifically with the pilgrimage festivals.

[6] See our explanation of this line in the previous section.

[7] See note 6.

[8] 42:4; 43:3-4; 84:6-8.

[9] For example, Yeshayahu 49:14-26; 51:17 and on; 52:1-2; Yechezkel 16:1 and on; 22:1-1; all of 23.

[10] In another psalm in the book of Tehillim in which the praises of Jerusalem are recounted, psalm 48, Jerusalem is addressed in the third person, and thus it lacks that feeling of intimacy of a personal relationship with Jerusalem as if it were a woman.

[11] As in our psalm, "Adabra na shalom bakh."

[12] As in Tehillim 87:3, "Nikhbadot medubar bakh."

[13] This poem was published in the press following the Six Day War, and then again in the pamphlet "Me'at Min Ha-Or" for Parashat Bechukotai, 5760. Unlike the Jerusalem in our psalm, Yitzchak Shelav's Jerusalem is a beloved, elderly woman, who had been visited with afflictions and the death of a child.

[14] As opposed to the vista of Jerusalem which reveals itself before the pilgrim approaching it, and therefore allows the psalmist to speak in second person, the tribes which go up to it on a regular basis and the thrones of David hidden away in its palaces are not revealed before him, and therefore he speaks of them in third person.

[15] This distinction between the two roles of Jerusalem, its being "the temple of the King" and "the city of royalty," stands at the heart of R. Kook's essay, "Chibat Yerushalayim," in his "Chazon Ha-Ge'ula," pp. 35-41, especially pp. 37-38.

[16] It is also possible that they reflect the pilgrims' exit from the Temple and Jerusalem and their farewell blessings. Amos Chakham raises both possibilities in his commentary, and we cited his words at the beginning of section IV. He himself adopts the possibility that "the psalm reflects the language of pilgrims who have completed their visit to Jerusalem and are about to leave the city and return to their homes." This is also the way he explains stanzas 1-2. We, on the other hand, are more persuaded by the other possibility – that the psalm accompanies the pilgrims through all the stages of their pilgrimage until their arrival at the Temple

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MoMo

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I don't read el kabong cos I read it all before, tested it, and found it false

Post  true lilly on Tue Aug 09, 2011 9:22 pm

true lilly wrote:
Billy Ruben wrote:
true lilly wrote:Foes are members whose messages will not be visible
and who won't be able to send you Private Messages or post on your Wall.

Note that you cannot ignore
the moderators or the administrators.
Foes list
Ciggy
el kabong

Add a foe: el kabong, AGAIN!

So, WHY even try to continue to convert me,?

"tintin" couldn't do it, in person, with all his money,
connections, threats made, and carried out?


How bloody weak are 'you',
to need to keep hammering me!
Oi,Billy
Ruben isn't on the list and Ciggy is and he isn't even posting,do you
fear Mr Ciggy the most,he'll take that as a compliment most high?

I must be amusing for you to be kept off the foes list eh?I make you smile...
I had some reason at the time,
board or something unimportant,
not worth remembering,
then,
billy kept texting me,
and I simply wanted to
compare his contradictions.

anyway...

[[[A Psalm] for Solomon 8010.]]
Give 5414 the king 4428 thy judgments 4941,
O God 430,
and thy righteousness 6666
unto the king's 4428 son 1121.

He shall judge 1777 thy people 5971
with righteousness 6664,
and thy poor 6041 with judgment 4941.

The mountains 2022 shall bring 5375
peace 7965 to the people 5971,
and the little hills 1389, by righteousness 6666.

He shall judge 8199 the poor 6041 of the people 5971,
he shall save 3467 the children 1121 of the needy 34,
and shall break in pieces 1792 the oppressor 6231 .

In his days 3117
shall the righteous 6662 flourish 6524 ;
and abundance 7230 of peace 7965
so long as the moon 3394 endureth.

He shall have dominion 7287
also from sea 3220 to sea 3220,
and from the river 5104
unto the ends 657 of the earth 776.

They that dwell in the wilderness 6728
shall bow 3766 before 6440 him;
and his enemies 341 shall lick 3897 the dust 6083.

The kings 4428 of Tarshish 8659
and of the isles 339 shall bring 7725 presents 4503:
the kings 4428 of Sheba 7614
and Seba 5434 shall offer 7126 gifts 814.

Yea, all kings 4428 shall fall down 7812 before him:
all nations 1471 shall serve 5647 him.

For he shall deliver 5337 the needy 34 when he crieth 7768 ;
the poor 6041 also, and [him] that hath no helper 5826 .



...Give 5414 the king 4428 thy judgments 4941,
O God 430,
and thy righteousness 6666
unto the king's 4428
son 1121.

1) king


From מָלַךְ (H4427)

1) to be or become king or queen, reign
a) (Qal) to be or become king or queen, reign
b) (Hiphil) to make one king or queen,
cause to reign
c) (Hophal) to be made king or queen
2) to counsel, advise
a) (Niphal) to consider
A primitive root

son 1121.


1) son, grandson, child, member of a group
a) son, male child
b) grandson
c) children (pl. - male and female)
d) youth, young men (pl.)
e) young (of animals)
f) sons (as characterisation,
i.e. sons of injustice [for un- righteous men]
or sons of God [for angels]
g) people (of a nation) (pl.)
h) of lifeless things, i.e. sparks, stars, arrows (fig.)
i) a member of a guild, order, class

From בָּנָה (H1129)

1) to build, rebuild, establish, cause to continue
a) (Qal)
1) to build, rebuild
2) to build a house (ie, establish a family)
b) (Niphal)
1) to be built
2) to be rebuilt
3) established (of restored exiles) (fig.)
4) established (made permanent)
5) to be built up (of childless wife
becoming the mother of a family
through the children of a concubine)
A primitive root


Yep, there is a lot said, in only those two words
(something all poets and psalmists understand),
but there are also words, rendered as 'king', 'son',
and 'kingdom', with other meanings,
in other contexts of Time and Place, such as:

[As] I live 2416, saith 5002 the Lord 136 GOD 3069,
surely in the place 4725 [where] the king 4428
[dwelleth] that made him king 4427 ,
whose oath 423 he despised 959 ,
and whose covenant 1285 he brake 6565 ,
[even] with him in the midst 8432 of Babylon 894
he shall die 4191 .

And the beginning 7225 of his kingdom 4467
was Babel 894, and Erech 751, and Accad 390,
and Calneh 3641, in the land 776 of Shinar 8152.

And the LORD 3068 said 559 unto him,
Call 7121 his name 8034 Jezreel 3157;
for yet a little 4592 [while], and I will avenge 6485
the blood 1818 of Jezreel 3157
upon the house 1004 of Jehu 3058,
and will cause to cease 7673 the kingdom 4468
of the house 1004 of Israel 3478.

For the kingdom 4410 [is] the LORD'S 3068:
and he [is] the governor 4910 among the nations 1471.

Thou 607, O king 4430,
[art] a king 4430 of kings 4430:
for the God 426 of heaven 8065
hath given 3052 thee a kingdom 4437,
power 2632, and strength 8632, and glory 3367.

...and so on and on, throughout God's Word,
if one cares to study, compare, test and let,
Holy Scripture interpret Holy Scripture,
what
the enemy call 'loose bricks'='contradictions',
one will find are in fact, the little details,
caveats and clarifications, that Prove The Truth
of The Faithfulness of God and His Living Word.


...and makes clear,
the (WHOLE WORLD, ALL EARTH, ALL PEOPLES,
FROM THE BEGINNING), ACTUAL,
TIME LINE that GOD'S WORD DESCRIBES
and
good, modern science keeps confirming.


Oh, and don't get excited and stumble over:

and will cause to cease 7673 the kingdom 4468
of the house 1004 of Israel 3478.

...remember, it's;
line upon line,
here a little, there a little,
precept upon precept,
command upon command...


...and ALWAYS REMEMBER that
the prince of death is NOT CREATIVE
so in his futile effort to
usurp David's Crown
and try to make himself 'god',
needs to take & twist the words of
The Creator of Life, Who CAN'T LIE,
and IS PERFECTLY JUST.
Smile Wink
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true lilly

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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:37 pm

[quote]
true lilly wrote:
true lilly wrote: I don't read el kabong cos I read it all before, tested it, and found it false...

LIAR; prove it. All your Biblical quotations are out of context anmd misused. HaSatan is a master at quoting scripture. thumbs up




The prophet Hosea was sent exclusively to the north just prior to his Assyrian captivity. In Hosea chapter one verses 1-9, Hosea tells Ephraim Israel or the House of Israel that his reign is coming to an end and that he will not be Yahuwah’s people and will have no compassion from Yahuwah. He will no longer be their Elohim. Yet miraculously in verse 10 of Hosea one, the same people show up again or are born again, this time not as a corporate nation but as individuals who have become returning children of Yahuwah. Verse ten calls these former northerners more numerable then the sands of the sea. It states that "the number of the children of Israel", shall be as the sand of the sea. That means that it is Ephraim Israel that is destined to produce the millions or even billions of spirit filled children of Yahuwah for Yahuwah, promised to the patriarchs. This truth is confirmed in verse 11 as we see Jew and Ephraimite both getting saved through the same King. Hosea 2:22-23 confirms this great truth. Remember their believing and coming to faith in Messiah and tragically perhaps even going to a Catholic church, still does not change their bloodline. That remains the same. Hosea chapter 2 verse 11 prophecies that after the northern house of Israel is dispersed by Assyria he will totally lose his identity because Yahuwah will cause him to forget Shabbat, the moedim (Feasts) and Rosh Chodesh (new moons). He will remove those visible signs of Israelism from him in order to facilitate his assimilation amongst true Gentiles. In their assimilated status as Gentiles, they will refer to Yahuwah as Baal, which means lord in English! We find this truth in Hosea 2:16&17. Yet when they return to Yahuwah through Messiah they will leave behind the names of paganized Gentile Christendom and begin to know and call Yahuwah "Ishi", meaning my husband. This prophecy coincides with Hosea 1:10. In Hosea 4:17 Yahuwah tells Judah to leave Ephraim alone since he is joined to idolatry. Hosea 5:9 talks about Ephraim’s heritage becoming desolate! The very desolate heritage Yahshua is said to revive in Isaiah 49:5-6. According to Hosea 5:15 Yahshua would return to heaven, but after two days or two thousand years Ephraim would be raised up to live both physically and spiritually in His sight. In context we see that the ten tribes of the former house of Israel will see national revival and restoration after two days or two thousand years after Messiah’s first advent. The sign that Ephraim’s punishment is coming to an end is the blindness to his true identity being removed. The sign that Judah’s punishment is coming to an end is his recognition of his blindness about the fact that Yahuwah has a Son who was manifest in the flesh for our forgiveness.

Hosea 7:8 states that Ephraim has mixed himself among the heathen. Obviously to find Ephraim Israel you have to look amongst the heathen. Verse 11 states that the road to the nations went through Assyria. Hosea 8:8 reiterates in the clearest possible terms that Israel will be swallowed up by the Gentile nations. The Hebrew word for swallow is bala, which literally means to become one flesh with by being devoured or taken away. In the same manner that meat eaten by a human being literally disappears and becomes one flesh with his body, so Israel (Ephraim), will become one and the same as the Gentile nations, even as Yahshua and His Father are Echad!. In scripture the term goy is a collective term for a nation and goy is never used in scripture in a derogatory manner against any individual since Gentiles mean corporate nations. There are even several references to the nation of Yisrael as "Goy Yisrael" instead of Am Yisrael. Hosea 7:8 & 8:8 states that Ephraim would live among the nations or Gentiles, as his severe punishment for counting Torah as a strange thing (Hosea 8:12). No matter how much Torah Yahuwah shared with Ephraim he wanted no part of it feeling restricted by it. Sound familiar ? It should. That is the current state of most non Jewish believers. In Hosea 9:11 a heart wrenching scripture states that Ephraim Israel will fly away like a bird, where there will be no birth, no carrying womb, no conception. Their future as recognizable Israelites will not continue, therefore no birth or conception (as Israelites). Verse 17 of Hosea 9 reiterates the clear historical fact that Ephraim Israel was destined to wander among the nations.

Even Moshe Rabainu prophesied this Ephraimite diaspora in Deuteronomy 33:16-17! Moshe said in verse 16 that Ephraim was always separated from his brethren and in verse 17 reiterates Ephraim’s eternal first born status as bullish or steadfast. Then amazingly he describes Ephraim as a unicorn which is the only member of the horse species with only one horn, symbolizing that when Ephraim would experience his yet future 721 BCE diaspora, he would be thrust out of Israel alone (one horn), without Judah his brother. The end of Devarim (Deuteronomy) 33:17 reconfirms that this unicorn (Ephraim) shall push the people of Israel to the ends of the earth, where being scattered, they will multiply and become known as the ten thousands of Ephraim and the thousands of Manasseh! WOW!

Despite this terrible correction, Yahuwah promised that this global scattering would not result in Ephraim’s destruction according to Hosea 11:9 and Jeremiah 31:35-37 and countless other texts. Therefore we know that though they have wandered and dwelt among the Gentiles becoming Gentiles, since Torah that was designed to knit them together, was treated as a strange thing to them, the Father promised that they would not be destroyed but would be individually preserved. If they are not destroyed and if one of Yahshua’s missions was to find them in their desolate heritage and rebuild the Tabernacle of David, where do you think many of them are today! That’s right. They are in many instances your non Jewish believing brothers and sisters according to Hosea 2:1! Wake up O Israel, put off your slumber and the truth will set you free!

Hosea 12:1 and Hosea 13:15, give very strong biblical clues to the current location of scattered Ephraim Israel. The Word states that Ephraim feeds on wind meaning he is being tossed around the globe and follows after an east wind. We know that an east wind blows west. Zechariah 10:8 -9 says that Yahuwah will whistle for Ephraim and summon them out of all the western nations where they have been sown. That glorious re-gathering of both houses in scripture is called the Day Of Jezreal, which literally means the regathering and replanting of that which was previously uprooted! All land today west and northwest of Israel such as the Americas, North, Central & South, as well as Europe and the British Isles are all locations of major population centers of Ephraimites.

Yair Davidy reached the following well documented conclusions from talmudic, historical, and archeological sources. Ephraim wound up in Britain, Manasseh in the USA, Reuben in France, Simeon in Celtic and Jewish Europe, Levi wherever the Jews went, Judah went everywhere, Issachar wound up in Switzerland and Finland, Zebulon wound up in Holland, Gad wound up in Sweden, Asher in Scotland, Benjamin with the Judahites in Belgium, Normandy and elsewhere. Dan with the Danes and Celts of Europe and Naphtali wound up with the Norwegians in Norway. As you can plainly see, both houses went just about everywhere though Judah was more successful at sticking together.

This north and northwest flight will result in millions from both houses returning to Israel in the last days from Russia where many multitudes of Ephraimites are found along with Judahites. Jeremiah 16:15-19 are strong proof texts that claim that the northern house of Israel went directly north to modern day Russia and the current area known as the Commonwealth of Independent States, that make up the former Soviet Union. They will return from the north country. That return will be so massive that it will cause ALL ISRAEL to downplay the Egyptian Exodus and magnify the numerically greater one currently underway. Messianic Judaism loves to proclaim Yahuwah’s majesty in the return of the Jew from the former Soviet Union as well as the Jewish revival currently underway there, yet it fails to take into account scriptures like Jeremiah 3:17-18, that state that in the last days when we see this massive return of Israelites from the north, or this Second Exodus, that it will be the seed and offspring of both houses returning to Israel. In other words it is time to wake up and smell the coffee and allow Messiah to give you light! Some of the folks that we call Jewish in the former Soviet Union that are excepting Messiah in record numbers and returning to the land of Israel are in fact Ephraimites not just Judahites. Yahuwah did not say He will bring Jewish Israel back and leave Ephraim Israel in the lands of the north only to suffer more pogroms (annihilation crusades) at the hands of anti-Semites like the Pamyat. Rather in Jeremiah 3:17-18, He stated that He will bring both houses back in the last days. Since both houses return it is obvious that both houses still exist. It is Yahshua’s gospel light that seeks to make these two into one new man called Israel! Jeremiah 50: 4-5 confirms that in order for all Israel to be regathered both houses will learn how to walk together away from Babylon and Rome and hand in hand return to Zion. Whether you like it or not, there is no scriptural regathering of Judah without or apart from a simultaneous and equally ambitious effort on Yahuwah’s part to regather the house of Joseph in the hand of Ephraim. They go together and are not separate rescues done at separate times! One must totally butcher scripture to even suggest that Judah’s return to the land of Israel is happening without brother Ephraimites. Whether Messianic Judaism at this juncture recognizes his brother or not, that will not stop the Father’s plan which shall stand above all others, coming to 1956.

Hosea 14:6 says that returning and repentant Ephraim will again be part of the olive tree of Israel. This is confirmed by Rav Shaul who in Romans 11:16 calls returning Ephraimites wild (paganized) olive branches. In Amos 9:8 Yahuwah promised to destroy the northern nation but in verse nine He says that as individuals, not a single grain will fall to the ground, or be destroyed among the nations or Gentiles where they are destined to go. Verse 11 of Amos 9 states that the reason that not a singular grain of Israelite corn will fall to the ground is that the Father must preserve them amongst the nations that they are going to be in, so that He can rebuild the Tabernacle of David which has fallen so completely. The idea of "LOST TRIBES", IS TOTALLY CHRISTIAN IN THEOLOGY AND HAS NO BIBLICAL OR JEWISH BASIS! There is much talmudic literature that talks about Ephraim still existing and waiting to experience a second birth through MOSHIACH!!

Ezekiel confirms the fact that the northern kingdom became Gentiles amongst the nations in such verses as Ezekiel 36:15-38. These verses also bring to light the fact that Judah is not mentioned since Judah at the time of Ezekiel in around 5OO BCE had only known Babylonian dispersion not global dispersion. In Ezekiel’s day the only segment of Israel that at the time of Ezekiel’s prophetic writings that had known global dispersion was the north or the house of Israel. The only place Jewish Israel needed to return from in Ezekiel’s time was Babylon, the ones who refused to return with Ezra and Nehemiah. That was only a one nation diaspora, not a global one. In Ezekiel 37:11 Yahuwah changes course by telling Ezekiel that the last days two stick vision is for the whole house of Israel. The addition of the word "whole" is confirmed in verses 12-28 where we see both houses that make up the whole clearly mentioned.

It is therefore beyond any shadow of a doubt that Ephraim Israel and to a lesser extent Jewish Israel is safe and sound in our day as they have been in every other day simply being sifted on an individual basis until Yahshua brings them back into New Covenant Israel one at a time. What will happen in the millennium as both houses come together fully is happening partially as Yahshua takes those far off, or far away from Jerusalem, as well as those near and makes both houses into one tree of life, by the precious blood of Messiah (Ephesians:2:13-14 ). The two houses, the near one and the far one, have after many years seen the ancient middle wall of partition broken down though Yahuwah’s Son. The gradual and progressive process which began at Calvary the day Yahshua died, will culminate at His return with the commencement of the Kingdom of Yahuwah on earth. HalleluYAH!

We do not need Herbert W. Armstrong, Mormons, the replacement theologians of British Israelism, or the American Indians, to tell us where to look for and find the Tabernacle of David restored and rebuilt. We need look no further than Yahshua’s body, the body of believers and you will find all of redeemed Israel living together in unity, harmony and love. Right under our nose, largely unknown to most of us, lies the mystery of regathered physical twelve tribe Israel. That is why Rav Shaul’s Olive Tree illustration is called a former mystery now revealed.

We see the first steps toward the inclusion of non Jewish Israelites in the Master’s visit to Samaria the former northern capital. In Matthew 10:5 He forbids any evangelism by his talmidim in Samaria which is openly acknowledged former Ephraimite territory. Yet in John chapter four we find Him ministering to the Ephraimite or Samaritan woman at the well. What’s going on? Why would He forbid his apostles from ministry in the hills of Samaria (Ephraim) and then turn right around and seemingly violate His own prohibition? The answer should be obvious. Due to His Jewish disciples prejudice and dislike of the Samaritans, Yahshua felt that they would botch the assignment at best, or fail to carry it out at worst. If left up to His talmidim they would more than likely bypass the hated Samaritans who were a half-breed race made up from the offspring of the widespread co-habitation of Ephraimites who stayed in the land, (at the request of the conquering colonial Assyrian Empire) and their conquerors. They were allowed to remain in the Samaritan mountains due to their farming ability which would provide food and provision for the conquering colonists. Unlike other armies such as Greece, Babylon and Rome, the Assyrian policy was to settle a conquered territory by assimilating their own people, as opposed to killing all the native inhabitants. This intermingling between colonial Assyrians and Ephraimite food providers, produced the mixed race of the hated Samaritans in existence at the time of Yahshua as well as today.

Despite the fact that they were half-breeds they had Israelite (not Jewish) blood. This fact is far beyond dispute or argument and is confirmed in such verses as John 4:5, where the city of Shechem is called a city of the house of Joseph, and verse six where Jacob’s well is mentioned. Since Jacob was the first Israelite and since he both dwelt and raised cattle there, we know this account takes place in the former northern kingdom territory. The Samaritan woman claims direct bloodline ancestry to Jacob in verse 12 of Yochanan 4, even calling Jacob or Israel her father. At no point does Yahshua rebuke or correct her assertion to her Israelite heritage, though He does rebuke her immorality. Had lying been one of her immoral character traits, He no doubt would have brought this up. The woman at the well was definitely an Israelite even though according to verse 9 of Yochanan 4,. Judean-Jews stayed away from Ephraim and Samaria, by refusing to go in and step out in love and recognition toward their brethren. Sound familiar? It should. Nothing has changed. His arrival to minister to her in Shechem an Ephraimite Samaritan village, was an open and unashamed act of love. There can be no doubt that Yahshua knew that this was a task that only He was capable of, due to Judah’s prejudice and blindness. May we be more like our Messiah when it comes to granting recognition and ministering love to those in our midst who claim Ephraimite blood, without administering a DNA test to them every time we see them, since genealogy cannot be proven or disproved. Genealogy is an issue of faith in who you think you are. Let’s be frank. Who would want to suffer as a Jew unless they were one? Who would want to receive vexation and ridicule as a non Jewish Israelite except one who really is one?

At the commencement of the modern day state of Israel in 1948, David Ben Gurion assembled 49 Jewish experts to determine who was a Jew eligible to return to Israel under Israel’s new law of return and came up with 49 diverse opinions! The conclusion to the whole matter was Ben Gurion’s famous remark born out of frustration with the rabbis, that a Jew "was anyone who said he was"! That must be our loving attitude to both Judahites and Ephraimites when they come into our midst, rather then refusing to deal with them or their claim to Israelite heritage unless they admit to being a "Gentile". As we covered in our last issue, there is no such thing as a saved Gentile and the Brit Chadasha confirms that in numerous places.



Once Yahshua opened the former northern kingdom to the gospel, He through the Ruach Hakodesh after His ascension sent Phillip (Acts 8:5-14) and almost all of Samaria believed and became born again non Jewish Israelites. As a matter of record this revival among Ephraim was so powerful that Shimon Keefa and Yochanan went up personally to survey and confirm the situation in Acts 8:14. Based on these and numerous other texts there is little doubt that the early Messianic community headquartered in Jerusalem, was made up of large numbers of Samaritans or non Jewish Israelites. What happened to their descendents and children? Didn’t they become believers? Isn’t that the goal of raising set apart children? These believing Israelite offspring that passed down the Messianic faith to future generations are still with us today. They are direct bloodline descendents of the early Samaritan believers. They are in our midst whether we grant them recognition or not! Also didn’t the early Jewish believers have children and grandchildren? Where are they? Didn’t early first century Messianic Jews represent all twelve tribes? That’s right many of them are still in the body of Yahshua 2000 years later right next to their Ephraimite brothers! It is utterly fascinating that in John 4:27 when the Jewish disciples returned to town only to find Yahshua witnessing to a Samaritan Israelite woman, that none of them asked Him what He was doing or why He was doing this, since they all knew instinctively that despite their own prejudice, Yahshua was as He said in Matthew 15:24, ministering only to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. By virtue of the fact that He was ministering to Samaritans they knew that He was starting the reclamation and returning of all Israelites to the fold. That is why they were neither shocked, alarmed or inquisitive. We must learn from their response in John 4:27 and not be shocked or threatened to discover through correct prophetic and biblical exegesis that Yahshua has been ministering to many non Jewish Israelites for the past two thousand years by placing them under His care in His body or His assembly.

The past two thousand years have seen the ongoing restoration of both houses of Yisrael only within Yahshua’s universal body. The great news however is that He will duplicate that which is going on in believing Israel and expand it to include all of lost Israel, as we approach the millennial reign of Yahshua on earth. Therefore it is both a Kingdom in the here and now as well as a Kingdom yet to come. He is bound to His Word. His Word is truth!





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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:41 pm

true lilly wrote: Oh, and don't get excited and stumble over:

and will cause to cease 7673 the kingdom 4468
of the house 1004 of Israel 3478.

Apparently you did and have extracted one verse out of context to make your deranged claim that you have replaced the Jews as YHWH Chosen People.....Replacement/supersseionism Theology is Demonic. YHWHs Covenant with the Jews and Israel is Eternal.........the verse you selected was a prophecy that the Apostate Kingdom of Israel would be destroyed and it was, likewise the Kingdom of Judah was destroyed for apostasy also.........but it does not say it would be permanent. YHWHs Covenants are Eternal.





http://www.yourarmstoisrael.org/

http://yourarmstoisrael.org/Articles_new/restoration/?page=home&type=2

here's lilly big lie exposed for all to see.


THE END TIME SOLUTION TO
REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY!
By Rabbi/Brother Moshe Yoseph Koniuchowsky
Part Three On Israel’s Exciting, and Glorious End Time Restoration!


The hideous falsehood known as replacement theology has been a cancer in theological circles for the past two millennia that just seems to refuse to go away. While replacement theology takes on different applications, and modes, it is a theology originated by the early non Jewish fathers of the so called "Christian Church". It coldly states that a new Rome centered, and Roman based ecclesiastical organization called "the church", is the "new Israel". This new Israel, would now forever replace Jewish Israel, since Yahuwah permanently rejected the Jews for killing their Messiah, His Son. Extreme proponents of replacement theology have even gone so far as to claim that Yahuwah, the mean, and cruel despot, was the Elohim of the Old Covenant Jews, as opposed to Yahshua who is the forever loving, kind, and compassionate Elohim who had REPLACED YAHUWAH AS LORD OF "THE CHURCH" OR THE SO CALLED "NEW ISRAEL". In other words, Yahshua’s people have replaced the Father’s people.

This hideous doctrine is by no means a small theological side issue to be argued in a local pub. It has been at the forefront of antisemitism, Judeo-phobia, and has fully provided fuel for tragic historical events such as the Spanish Inquisition, the Catholic Crusades, the ouster of the Jews from every European country, as well as the Nazi holocaust. As history clearly demonstrates, Martin Luther, and other Protestant reformers blueprinted both the call, and the plans for the annihilation of the Jewish nation from Europe, and later the world by providing "so called Christians", with biblical justification to perpetrate genocide on world Jewry. Adolph Hitler knew full well that he could find theological approval, and support from these church folks. The inbred functionalism of this spiritual cancer amongst those that preach Yahshua is so widespread that it cannot be fully reversed, and eliminated until Yahshua’s millennial reign begins shortly when He returns to the earth. Even such seemingly benign church doctrines such as "Kingdom Now" theology or "Dominion" theology, where the so called "church" will christianize the world through the establishment of the bible as a global constitution, and whereby all world powers, and authorities will be won to, and taken over by Christendom, are nothing more than new attempts at replacing the "troublesome Jews". Wasn’t this flawed global christianization program, whereby Yahshua would merely take over a globally loyal populace converted through church efforts, already tried numerous times? Historically they were called the Crusades, Inquisitions, and Pogroms. Was it not the Crusaders who were attempting to take the globe by the sword, and convert, and subdue it by the gospel?...............These hideous theologies call anything Jewish to be anti Christ, and legalistic. Jewish practices are not welcome in their church systems. It is simply fascinating to me that "the church" has this insatiable desire to institute biblical law, and church sovereignty over the globe by spreading Yahuwah’s laws, when one of the major errors within Christianity is the very rejection, and the denial of the validity of first covenant instruction in New Covenant times.

The so called "church" system has repeatedly, and pridefully proclaimed to its adherents that the Torah or the laws of first covenant Israel are passed away, and nailed to the cross, and have therefore been replaced by the second covenant law, which is love, baby, love. In other words, this man made ecclesiastical organization started, funded, and headquartered in Rome, now wants to force their paganized Christendom down the throats of the worlds populace, with obedience to THE TEN COMMANDMENTS, and other teachings all based on the Decalogue, all the while instructing her very own members that it is not applicable to the New Covenant "church". Now you talk about confusion! How can a man made ecclesiastical system that is boastfully, and wrongfully antinomian (anti-Torah), at it’s very core theology, force the world’s populace to submit to rules, and regulations that they themselves loath as having preceded from the Jewish despot named Yahuwah, and His Jews? Remember that in true replacement theology a pagan blonde haired, and blue eyed European, pork eating Jesus (the English translation of the sun deity Zeus), has replaced Yahuwah the Father as LORD (from the pagan deity Lourdes), over his "church" (from the pagan circular ritual conducted by the Celts).

.......


Last edited by el kabong on Thu Aug 11, 2011 5:34 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:42 pm

http://yourarmstoisrael.org/Articles_new/restoration/?page=1&type=12

wave

The Full Restoration Of Israel!
Part I of a Series
In Genesis 13:14-16 Yahuwah our Heavenly Father promised Abram the land of Canaan as well as a promise of physical multiplicity of his zera or his seed (sperm). Abram was told that this promise of physical multiplicity will be so vast and so extensive that the entire earth will literally be full of his zera. Verse 16 reminds us that at the time that this promise is literally and physically brought to pass it will be absolutely impossible for mankind to even count it, or in any way census it, since mankind is totally impotent and unable to count the dust of the earth. This promise is straightforward, needing absolutely no interpretation or explanation. That same seed will inherit the land eventually to be known as Israel.

In Genesis 15 verses 1-6 we see Abram willing to help Yahuwah fulfill the promise of Genesis 13 by prematurely and incorrectly choosing Eliezer, a Gentile, who is not a physical offspring of Abram's own sperm or zera, to be the one through whom that promise would be brought to pass. However Yahuwah rebukes Abram and makes it clear to him that His promise of physical multiplicity that would become a number that man would not be able to number would not come through an adopted Gentile or a second class choice. No! Our Heavenly Father ordained that this promised heir would come from Abram's own body. He would not be adopted but he would be a physical descendent of Abram. It is through this physical descendent that Yahuwah once again promises Abram that his physical offspring will be more than the stars of Heaven. Obviously through modern science we know that our solar system has billions of stars and of course that other solar systems have many more billions. These stars in totality produce a number that mankind cannot even fathom. Yahuwah challenges Abram's lack of ability in counting the stars with the words "if you can" in verse five. It is because of Abram's pure faith and trust in Yahuwah that he receives imputed righteousness as a result of his believing and trusting in Yahuwah's promise. Notice there is only one promise not many promises. Abram was declared righteous by faith in Yahuwah's one promise. Whoever this physical seed would turn out to be it would literally have to be more than the dust particles of the sea and the visible stars of heaven. This promise must be taken extremely and solely on a literal face value. Any tendency to somehow spiritualize this promise is a lack of faith in Yahuwah's literal Word. That would be the very opposite of the faith of Abram himself.

This promise of physical multiplicity and blessing is renewed in Genesis 17 verse 4 where Abram is told that this promise will establish him as a father of many nations or "hamon goyim". This term "hamon goyim" is also found in verse 5 and literally means a noisy multitude of Gentile nations. This physical seed that will literally fill the globe will not be a silent group of religious folks, rather they will be a great and noisy multitude making a great noise and tumult about Yahuwah and His gospel love for humanity. Verse 6 of Genesis 17 promises Abraham that through this seed of promise, kings would be manifest. This of course is talking about the kings that would one day make up the royal House of David through whom Messiah would come to His throne. In verse 7 Yahuwah reassures Abraham that this promise of greatness through physical multiplicity would be unconditional and everlasting.

After the testing of Abraham's faith in Genesis 22, Yahuwah renews the promise, due to Abraham's great obedience in the binding of Isaac on Mt Moriah. In verses 17&18 Yahuwah reminds Abraham that it is he that will inherit the physical promise of physical multiplicity when his seed one day becomes more than the stars of heaven and the dust of the earth. In verse 18 we see that from this earth filling seed, will come one (Messiah), through whom all of the earth's families will be blessed. In Genesis 24 verse 60, Rebecca's family prophetically prays over her in order that her children may become "myriad's of peoples" and rule over their enemies.

In Genesis 26 verse 4 we see this promise of physical increase being renewed with Abraham's son Isaac. He is told that his zera will be more than the stars of heaven. Sound familiar? Isaac becomes the heir of this promise not Ishmael. Therefore when Yahuwah brings to pass this great and precious promise it will not be through an adopted Gentile like Eliezer or a child of the flesh like Ishmael, but rather through the child of promise (Isaac) the heir proceeding from Abraham's own body. Galatians 4:28 confirms that only Isaac is the child of promise. What promise? The promise of physical multiplicity that would fill the earth, yet still possess the land of Canaan as it's own homeland.

Genesis 28 verse 3 finds Isaac blessing Jacob and prophesying that the promise that Yahuwah gave Abraham and Isaac would now be bestowed upon Jacob and not Esau. We see that in verse three Isaac prays that Jacob's zera, would be blessed and become a "kehelat goyim" or "assembly of peoples." For the first time in scripture we get a glimpse of Yahuwah's plan for filling the earth with the seed of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. The Hebrew term found in verse three is "kehelat goyim" or an assembly of nations or even better an "assembly of goyim". Somehow the Father will fill the earth with the physical seed of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob by putting together an assembly of goyim. Verse 4 confirms that what Isaac is bestowing upon Jacob is none other than the blessing of Abraham.

It is absolutely crucial for us to understand that there are not many promises to Abraham. There are not some that are spiritual and some others that are physical. Rather there is one promise and that one promise contains two aspects of physical blessing. One is the seed who would bless the nations, that being Messiah Yahshua Himself, the other being merely a promise of physical reproduction and multiplicity. In Genesis 28 in the account of Jacob's ladder we find Yahuwah telling Jacob that his seed will be spread out as the dust of the earth and will break forth to the four corners of the globe. In other words his offspring would find its home in Canaan land, but would somehow through Yahuwah's divine plan break forth and find its way to the four corners of the earth. This promise is none other than the bestowing upon Jacob of the promise and blessing of Abraham. The Hebrew term used in Genesis 28 verse 14 is the term "parats" meaning to break forth. It literally means to jump out and spread quickly. This promise of physical multiplicity must come through Abraham, Isaac and Jacob therefore nullifying any claims by Islam and Ishmaelites or any other misguided Bible scholars claiming that this promise is fulfilled in adding the Jews and Muslims together. That is wrong since this promise must come through Isaac and Jacob not Ishmael and Esau. The Ishmaelite, Arab and Muslim peoples are the physical descendants of Abraham alone, not of the promised heirs Isaac and Jacob. They do not, I repeat do not, meet the standards set down by Yahuwah when He stated that the promise of physical multiplicity would come through Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. The faith of Islam is not the faith of Abraham because in order to have the faith of Abraham one must believe it was Isaac not Ishmael who was the chosen seed!

We find Yahuwah elaborating on this promise to Jacob in Genesis 35:10-11 where He declares to Jacob that he would no longer be known as Jacob but as Israel. Israel means one who as a prince struggles with Yahuwah and prevails. It is as Israel that Jacob will produce sperm that will lead to the establishment of a nation and a company of nations. The nation of course is destined to be the Jewish people and the company of nations will be the "kehelat goyim" or the assembly of nations (Gentiles) that will proceed from his own body.

As we jump forward in time we find Israel the great patriarch dying in the land of Goshen in Egypt and he summons all his sons to his bedside as he is dying. He somehow finds enough strength and leans on his staff and begins to prophecy through the Ruach HaKodesh the events that will befall his sons in the last days. The Brit Chadasha (New Covenant) refers to these deathbed prophecies of Israel as an act of worship. In Genesis 48:5 he adopts Joseph's children born in Egypt, Ephraim and Manasseh as his own. He is declaring his last will and testament right there in front of Joseph. He officially adopts these two boys so that Joseph his most beloved son can receive a double portion of blessing through both his sons (verse 22). In verse 16 of Genesis 48 he calls these two grandchildren "Israel", since he not only adopts them but prophetically declares that the physical promise of physical global multiplicity will come through them. After stating "let my name be called upon them," meaning they are Israel's children, he prays that they will become a multitude. The Hebrew term used here for multitude can be read as a "teeming multitude of fish". It is interesting to remember that it was none other than our Messiah Yahshua who declared that He would make us fishers of men. Could many of the men he was referring to be the "teeming multitude proceeding from Ephraim and Manasseh?

As Israel is about to pronounce blessing he lays his right hand on Ephraim instead of Manasseh who was Joseph's firstborn. The right hand is symbolic of the blessing of the first born and should have rightfully fallen to Manasseh. However above the protests of Joseph, Israel crosses his hands and place the right one on the second of Joseph's sons Ephraim. When Joseph objects Israel tells him not to worry that he knows exactly what he is doing and that while Manasseh will become a great nation, Ephraim will be greater than him. In Genesis 48:19 we have one of the most fascinating and important prophecies of scripture. In blessing Ephraim over and above his brother, Israel declares that the seed or zera of Ephraim will become the "maleh goyim", or the "fullness of the Gentiles". In other words the physical seed of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob that was promised to one day literally fill the earth as the sand and dust of the earth and stars of heaven, will now come to pass in and through Ephraim. Ephraim will be the vehicle though which the great and precious single promise of physical multiplicity will literally come to pass. In English the words "maleh hagoyim" can best be translated as the "fullness of the Gentiles". If that term sounds familiar it should. It is a quotation from Romans 11:25 by Rav Shaul (Paul) as the method and means by which all Israel would be saved. The only other time this word maleh is used in Tanach is in Psalm 24:1, where the psalmist declares that the earth is Yahuwah's and the fullness thereof. In other words the earth is full of peoples, places and things that belong to Yahuwah and there is nothing found in the earth that does not belong to Yahuwah. In like manner there will be virtually no one in the earth that is not somehow belonging to the seed of Ephraim since it is the seed of Ephraim where all the blessings of physical multiplicity will be found. More on that later.

Not only do we see Ephraim receiving the birthright of the first born over and above his older brother Manasseh, but Israel also removes it from Reuben in Genesis 49:3 & 4 since Reuben defiled his father's bed and was sexually impure regarding the privacy and intimacy of Israel's marriage bed. So in reality Ephraim is moved ahead of Reuben, Joseph and Manasseh to receive the blessing of the firstborn of Israel. First Kings 5:1-2 and Jeremiah 31:9, confirms this essential truth. There is however some needed insight at this point. In all ancient Mideast cultures the right of the firstborn was essential in establishing lordship over the house of the dying father. With the birthright went power, authority, respect, grandeur and the right to enact all family business and transactions pertaining to its sustenance, care and well being. In essence the birthright was the permission to the firstborn to take over and rule the fathers' house in the fathers absence through death. Isaac received this right from Abraham even as Jacob received it from Isaac, albeit deceitfully. With the birthright went power and therefore it was coveted greatly in that culture.

When Israel gave Ephraim the birthright, however, he gave it to him with one major reservation. We read about this in Genesis 49:8-10, where Judah is given the pre-eminence or power to rule and reign royally over the House Of Israel! In verse 9 it states that all Israel's children will bow before the royalty of Judah and verse 9 states that the pre-eminence will cause all Israel to pay homage to the Lion of Judah whom verse 10 refers to by the Messianic moniker of Shiloh. Shiloh means the "sent one" or the anointed King Messiah from the kingly line of Judah who would be manifest in the natural through the tribe of Judah. Hebrews 7:14 makes it clear that Yahshua was Shiloh and it is evident that He sprang forth from Judah. What a mess! Did Jacob make a major error? Did he go to all the trouble of establishing Ephraim as the firstborn with the firstborn birthright only to give him a title without authority and without preeminence over his brothers? Did he make Ephraim a puppet ruler with just a paper title much like the modern day Queen of England? One thing we know for sure. He brought a split into and among the sons of Israel since one son had a birthright but the other son Judah had the right to rule! What good is a birthright without the authority that goes along with it? The children of Israel would submit to Judah's seed not Ephraim's, yet Ephraim's seed would become the fullness of the Gentiles. Judah would rule over the House Of Israel, but Ephraim would bring forth the promised zera that would fill the globe with the promise to the patriarchs of physical multiplicity. Of course Israel knew what he was doing since he was ministering through the Ruach HaKodesh. He split the authority and blessing between the two brothers who would continue to wage war over the fullness of the blessing that would ultimately be played out in a battle royal over the title of who is Israel? How ironic that according to Genesis 49:10 it will be the Lion of Judah (Messiah Yahshua), that would gather the goyim or nations of the seed of Ephraim back into the House Of Israel! After Israel died and his children waxed great in Egypt this promise of physical multiplicity began to trouble a Pharaoh who knew not Joseph. Of course he enslaved the Hebrews and it took Moshe Rabainu our great deliverer to rescue Israel from the house of bondage. As history teaches us Moshe took the twelve tribes out of Egypt to Sinai where they received Torah and the twelve tribes settled the land of Canaan. After a period of diverse judges and after King Saul, David was anointed King over all Israel. In the days of David the King, we see the house of Judah ruling and reigning over a united Israel with 12 tribes under David's monarchy. All was well until Solomon, David's' son, began whoring physically as well as spiritually and Yahuwah revealed to Solomon that the kingdom would be broken in the life of his son Rehoboam because of Solomon's sins. (First Kings 11:11-14). Yahuwah further revealed to Jeroboam an Ephraimite, one of Solomon's talented craftsman, that he would receive ten tribes resulting from this split in the kingdom of Israel after Solomon's death. This prophecy was acted out in front of Jeroboam by Ahiyah the prophet. The glory days under David was the last time that the kingdom belonged to all Israel, made up of all twelve tribes. In approximately 921 BC the ten northern tribes broke away from the House Of David and called themselves Israel making Samaria its capital. The southern tribes of Judah, Benjamin and Levi made up the southern kingdom under Rehoboam with Jerusalem as its capital (Read First Kings 11:26-43). As Rehoboam prepares an army to retake the ten renegade tribes in the north, Yahuwah forbids it in First Kings 12:24 by telling Rehoboam that this split in the House Of David is from Him and that they should not fight against their brothers.

This split in 921 BC was simply the literal fulfillment of the prophetic unction's pronounced by Jacob over his sons when he split the family so to speak. He split the birthright between Ephraim and Judah and that is why Yahuwah says in First Kings 12:24 that this family split is from Him. He ordained it and desired it so that He could bring to pass the promise He made to the patriarchs. Specifically the promise of physical multiplicity. The means by which our Heavenly Father chose to do this is through this split in David's House. We will see why later! What began with Jacob now was being played out in the natural. The Northern kingdom of ten tribes began to adopt pagan practices, holidays, customs, false worship and unfortunately Jeroboam became the father of Ephraimite pagans. In First Kings 12:26-33 we see the evil heart of Jeroboam son of Nebat at as he devised a scheme for the ten tribes collectively known as the House of Israel or Ephraim to begin to practice a false religion designed to keep Ephraim separate from Judah and separate from Judah's Elohim. As we will shortly come to realize this House of Ephraim would one day become hidden as individuals within the Christian Church through Yahuwah's program of the regathering of Ephraim through Messiah Yahshua and would adopt all of the ungodly pagan practices of Jeroboam. This system of Jeroboam had as its basic design the creation of a separate entity from the House of David consisting of the ten tribes in the north.

This separation unto debauchery and unto Ephraim's departure from the family of Israel resulted in Yahuwah's judgement in approximately 721 BCE when Yahuwah send Tilgat Pilsger III, the Assyrian king to utterly destroy the House Of Ephraim or the ten northern tribes. Since Ephraim played the harlot and lifted her skirt to every foreign deity, Yahuwah declared that he would in like manner sift her and cause her to be naked before the Gentile nations, by bringing an end to the northern kingdom, of Israel. This stern punishment would be enacted by the dispersing and swallowing up of these ten tribes by the world's pagan nations. Since Ephraim's lust, penchant and desire for paganism was so great Yahuwah permitted the ten tribes to become the very thing that they so desperately and so wickedly craved to be! Thus we find that the children of Israel experienced their first holocaust in 721 BCE when ten tribes seemingly disappeared and became lost spiritually as well as physically. Thus was born the ten lost tribes of Israel.

As we are about to discover this breakage was the method by which Yahuwah chose to fulfill the family split caused by Jacob himself as well as to fulfill the promise of physical multiplicity to the patriarchs. Are the ten tribes really lost? Can they be found? Have they been destroyed or somehow preserved? Did the Messiah come to restore the Tabernacle of David which had fallen in 920 BCE? Did the ten lost tribes of Israel become Gentiles later to be regathered back into the house Of Israel by the ministry of Moshiach? Is it possible that the ten tribes became the "maleh goyim" or the "fullness of the Gentiles" that we read about in Romans and that was promised to be the physical Israelite seed through Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Ephraim? Let's find out!

The prophet Hosea is a great place to start our definitive search for the other house of Israel, the House of Ephraim. From this point forward the key to understanding prophecy related to the restoration of the twelve tribes into the House Of David is to understand that after the split in 921 BCE Yahuwah almost never ever refers to one house but to two houses of Israel! When He speaks to the North (10) tribes He speaks of Israel or Ephraim. When He speaks to the South He speaks of Judah. He always separates these two entities and unless you learn to do likewise you cannot and will not understand any prophetic writings or prophecies given by any of Israel's prophets after the split of the House of David. Get it fully settled in your minds that after 921 BC there were and still are two separate houses of Israel!! If you can comprehend this truth you are well on your way to being an instant prophecy expert!

In Hosea chapter One, the prophet sent to the northern kingdom of Israel is told to take a wife who is a whore since that would give him a pretty good idea what the ten tribes have done to Yahuwah. After cohabiting with Gomer, Hosea calls their daughter "Lo-Ruhammah" (verse 6), meaning no mercy or compassion. In verse 4 of Hosea One we see Yahuwah putting an end to the northern House Of Israel and in verse 6 He promises to never again show Israel in the north any mercy. In verse 7 Yahuwah stated that unlike Israel, He will show mercy to Judah in the south. The couple conceived a son in verse 9 and Yahuwah commands Hosea to call his name "Lo-Ami" for you are not my people and I am not for you. When Yahuwah is against you the party is over. Israel or Ephraim is called Lo-Ami, not my people. It is adios , good bye and good night Irene! No more mercy, no more my people, no more a kingdom, and Yahuwah fighting against you. We see clearly the end of the ten northern tribes as a nation before Yahuwah. A total divorce and rejection has taken place. Hosea 7:8,8:8,9:11,9:17,10:1,12:1 and other passages confirm that Ephraim's plight is to become Lo-Ami, swallowed up among the Gentiles. Yet in verse 10 we see a startling declaration. Despite a death sentence for the ten tribes as an identifiable kingdom or nation, miraculously they reappear and are born-again so to speak in the last days. Verse 10 of Hosea One begins with the words "Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the seashore. Here we have a kingdom totally destroyed and swallowed up among the Gentiles, miraculously reappearing as the former children of Israel and are even called the sand of the sea! Sound familiar? It should! This is the sand of the sea promise made to the patriarchs and to Ephraim. This verse further reveals to us just where we are going to find the ten lost tribes or the sand of the sea that cannot be counted. The ones who call themselves and are called by Yahuwah children of Elohim! Do you know any modern day group of people that run around referring to themselves and claiming themselves to be children of the living Yahuwah! You got it! The born-again community of Gentile believers is nothing more than the former dispersed House Of Israel. Yahuwah further states in this verse that when Ephraim is gathered they will be His people or His Ami and He will be their Elohim since they have become sons of the living Elohim by grace though faith (Hosea 2:21-23). This cannot possibly be made any clearer. A nation that has come to an end, disappeared or become lost if you will, all of a sudden showing up as sons and daughters of Yahuwah in the last days! Elohim Himself reminds us in verse 10 that this group in nothing more than the former House of Jeroboam or House of Israel. In verse 11 of Hosea One we see this return of the ten lost tribes coming back into the House Of David in the days when these former lost Israelites appoint for themselves the same head that Messianic Jews are appointing for themselves. This one head is the head of the body made up of nothing more than Judahites and Ephraimites with perhaps some true Gentiles, now restored to Yahuwah as redeemed individuals from both houses and are learning to trust and lean on the same Head by appointing that Head (Yahshua) as personal Elohim and Savior! Verse 11 goes on to say that when individual Ephraimites and Judahites are making this personal appointment of Yahshua as king of their lives it will not be a day to build something called "a church" where "the church" replaces the Jew, rather it will be the day of Jezreal. Jezreal means the replanting of those who were scattered! Baruch HaShem Yahuwah. Notice the very next verse in Hosea 2:1, where both Judahites and Ephraimites who appoint Yahshua as their head (in the day of Jezreal's regathering and replanting into David's rebuilt Tabernacle), will no longer look at their brothers and sisters as spiritual brothers or sisters only, but will see them in a new light. What light is that? As "ami!" My own people. Bone of my bone and flesh of my flesh. When Ephraim and Judah are individually regenerated and regathered into the rebuilt Tabernacle of David then we will begin to recognize each other as blood brothers, as physical Israelites from different sides of the same family that have been redeemed by the blood of the Lamb!



Remember that in Matthew 15:24 Yahshua stated in the clearest possible terms that he was sent for no one except the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Notice He did not state that He came for Gentiles or Jews. He did not come only for Jews because Jews are Judahites physically descended from the two southern tribes that made up the Kingdom of Judah. He also has no interest in Gentiles. Why? Because those who respond to Yahshua's love, and come back to the restored Tabernacle of David, may look like Gentiles, act like Gentiles, behave like Gentiles, eat pork and break the Shabbat like Gentiles, but are in fact nothing more than the lost physical sheep of the house of Israel who became the Gentiles and have been living like Gentiles for 2700 years. Obviously when they come back they are not going to look like Israelites who practice and are faithful to Torah. Either you are going to believe Yahshua and scores of other prophets or you are going to make up your own theology. He said I have come only for all the lost sheep of the House of Israel. This includes the Jews but also includes the other house of Israel, who are my brothers in the flesh. Of course Paul, Peter and others were sharing the gospel with Gentiles because where else are you going to find the seed of Ephraim, except among the Gentiles filling the globe. Amos 9:9 tells us that though scattered among the Gentiles, not one grain or person will fall to be destroyed. In other words they will not disappear from the earth, but will mix and literally become the peoples of the earth, only to be brought back to Yahuwah in the end times, on an individual basis. The Great Commission (Matt: 28 18-20) therefore is nothing more than a world wide search for the seed of Ephraim the sand of the sea, dust of the earth, the teeming multitudes of humanity. Part of that search of course will be to look for the dispersed of Judah as well. Yaakov (James) testifies to this truth by reminding the Jerusalem Council that Yahuwah was just visiting the Gentiles nations through the preaching of the gospel, not to live there, but to rescue and pull out His people called by His Name ( Acts 15:14-17). Through this rescue James reminds us that Yahuwah is rebuilding The Tabernacle Of David made up of all the twelve tribes of Israel. Since He is Israel's Elohim, He is pulling out and rescuing Israelites from the "outcast status" that had been their inheritance due to their disobedience to Torah. These people are Israelites regardless of whether they themselves realize it or not! Is not that what it means to be lost? Lost spiritually as well as physically!

Is it not fascinating that after three and a half years of Yahshua's earthly ministry as He is about to ascend back to heaven from the Mt. of Olives, all remaining eleven talmidim come to Him and ask Him the same exact question. This is almost unimaginable since these eleven rarely agreed on anything and were always fighting and asking questions, seeking to bolster their own agenda. Yet in total unanimity they all had the same final question. Master, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel? (Acts1:6) That is what they were concerned with. Not the creation or building of a separate entity called "the church" which has sought to replace, annihilate and often destroy the Judahite people. Let it be clearly understood that the word "church" is nothing more than the ekklesia or assembly of the Tanach. It is the same assembly that was receiving Torah on Mt. Sinai (Acts7:37-38). There is one New Covenant assembly, called Israel by Rav Shaul (Galatians 6:16). There is no such thing as a separate entity called "the church", with a separate Shabbat and a separate holy day schedule. In Spanish and Portuguese and almost every language ekklesia meaning those "called out ones" maintains the basic idea of an assembly. Only in English do we have this "church" (derived from a pagan circular blood ritual called "church") word that appears to be teaching that Yahshua built something new called "the church", when all He was doing was rebuilding the mikra or assembly of the Tanach and filling it with power. When the Septuagint translation of the Tanach was translated from Hebrew to Greek around 175 B.C.E., every translator translated the word mikra into ekklesia and that is exactly what Yahshua Himself claims to have come to build (Matthew 16:16-19)! The oldest New Covenant manuscripts in our possession today and written in Aramaic (a dialect of Hebrew), confirm the absence of the word "church" again using in its place the word "assembly." Because of Ephraim's jealousy and hatred of his brother Judah, along with an ongoing addictive attraction to anything pagan or foreign to Torah (like father like son), he decided to become a separate man-made entity known as "the church" totally divorced from Jacob's family and it's rich Hebraic roots, which explains why today the "church" as it mostly stands is absolutely unrecognizable to both Jews and often to Yahuwah Himself! This self-desired divorce from Israel has left "the church" without any tools with which to provoke Judah to jealousy. She is a man-made self willed religious divorcee from the covenant people of Israel!

The gospel is not merely a proclamation of personal salvation. It is a message of national restoration to Israel from a divided family which manifested itself in two still separate houses of Israel. Matthew 24:14 reminds us that the gospel is the gospel of the Kingdom. In Matthew chapter 12 Yahshua speaks of the principal of a divided house without any ability to withstand the fiery darts of Satan! What kingdom? The kingdom of Israel. In Luke 24:21 the talmidim were very disappointed since they fully and rightfully expected the twelve tribes to be resorted under Yahshua the Moshiach. Where would they get that idea from? Jeremiah 23 verses 3-6 Yahuwah declares that He will bring Israel and Judah back from global dispersion in the days that Messiah arrives. In verse 5 and 6 it states that Judah shall be saved and Israel shall dwell safely. We see the reunification of both houses under the Messiah or the reunification of all twelve tribes all living in the land of Israel. Remember that in order for the House of David to be fully restored and rebuilt it has to be composed of the same composition that left Egypt, received Torah and made up the glory days of King David. All twelve tribes! Any revival or restoration movement that does not include the full restoration of all twelve parts of the family and merely focuses in on two parts of the twelve parts, is not flowing in a full vision of restoration. Messianic Judaism in order to continue to experience the full last days blessings of Yahuwah, must expand it's vision to include all of Israel. The vision does not have to be changed at all and should be of no threat to Messianic Judaism's leadership, once it determines the truth of Israel's two houses and demands that Ephraim renounce all paganism and embrace the fabric of Israelite living and holiness which is Torah. The future of the last days revival of Israel and the very fabric and survival of the modern Messianic Jewish movement depends on a leadership ready to re-evaluate the preservation of Ephraim for 2,700 years amongst and as Gentiles. That is the final "Tikun HaOlam" (restoration between Judah & Ephraim), spoken of in Ezekiel 37:11-28! It is wrong for bible students & Messianic leaders to teach and believe that Judah, Ephraim, and Israel are all the same and are really analogous or synonymous interchangeable terms, whose usage varies, depending upon what mood Yahuwah is in. That is historically inaccurate as well as theologically deceptive and if Yahuwah is able to differentiate between the two still divided houses after 720 BCE, why can't we?

Go back now and read your Bible, understanding that when Yahuwah refers to the ten tribes it is always Ephraim or Israel and when He refers to the two southern tribes it is always as Judah. Try it! Your eyes will be open to the true, everlasting and final Tikun HaOlam. If you refuse to read your Bible without that foundational premise, then you are bound to find an Elohim who is repetitive, confused and throws terms around referring to two nations when there is really one. Of course based on this faulty reasoning Yahuwah is not too swift at identifying and locating the outcasts of Israel (Ephraim) either! Do you really believe that? Of course not! You and I may not know where to look for the ten tribes but rest assured Yahshua does, and that is exactly what He has been doing for two thousand years right under our collective nose, since that was His assignment according to Isaiah 49:5-6. During that same time period we were all busy fussing and fighting as two brothers engaged in sibling rivalry!

What it all boils down to is, whose report will you believe? An Israel made up of two tribes or one made up of twelve which Yahuwah Himself vowed to fill the earth with. Since He is faithful you can rest assured that almost everyone on this planet has a drop of Israelite blood since Yahuwah' blessing of physical multiplicity would fill the globe through Ephraim's banishment and subsequent intermarriage and assimilation. If the earth is full of Israelite blood how much room is there left for any other types of peoples without some Israelite blood? If this promise to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob has been literally fulfilled only through the Jewish people alone, who continue to number only 16 million and can easily and readily be counted, censused and numbered, then the promise to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is an outright lie! Yahuwah lied! Sixteen million Jews does not constitute a multitude that cannot be numbered! Sixteen million or so Jews could all fit nicely into the land mass of the state of Florida. The promise of physical multiplicity was not fulfilled in Judah alone! That is a numerical and practical impossibility! The question before you is not can everyone on earth really have at least a drop of Israelite blood? The question before you is did Yahuwah lie and speak in half truths? Are we to take him at his literal word? This teaching of the two houses submits the truth that Ephraim plus Judah with a few true Gentiles (?), equals billions of human beings and from those billions (5 or 6 billion), a remnant Israel is being saved from all twelve tribes and are being reconciled to Yahuwah through the precious blood of the one who declared "I came only for the lost sheep of the house of Israel"! Whose report will you believe? Those promoting separate entities and thus two Israels, one physical and the other spiritually adopted, or Yahuwah who has only one physical Israel, that is spirit filled and led, taken from all twelve tribes, with no one being adopted into physical Israel, but requiring everyone Jew and non-Jew to be adopted into Yahuwah's family! The choice is yours! Is it possible that the real reason behind the reason of saved Judah's carefree, careless attitude towards trying to discover where in the world the rest of his lost physical family really is, is nothing more than a colossal case of a self centered mindset! In Judah's defense it is perhaps possible that Judah is too busy trying to survive the Diaspora than to be concerned about finding his brother's whereabouts. Regardless of the real reason, Yahuwah only deals with these two chosen families in the earth (Jeremiah 33:24).

Is it not interesting that the promised New Covenant of Jeremiah 31:31-34 talks about Yahuwah cutting a covenant with the House Of Israel and the House of Judah never once mentioning cutting one with Gentiles or Christians. The House of Israel mentioned in Jeremiah is Ephraim those born-again non-Jews. Remember that all Jews are Israelites but not all Israelites are Jews. In the heavenly Jerusalem of Revelation 21:12 notice that all those born again folks planning on having everlasting life must enter the city through one of 12 gates, one for each of the twelve tribes. Isn't it funny and strange how Yahuwah forgot to make a gate for Christians or "saved Gentiles". The reason is that everyone in New Covenant Israel from both sides of the physical family is a blood descendent of Israel with some few exceptions. Even those exceptions become Israelites according to Torah! I'll discuss more on that in the next issue.

In Jeremiah 31:3-22 we read detailed descriptions of Ephraim (ten tribes) returning to the land. Any aliyah or any program of returning Jews to Israel to live must and will include all Israel including Ephraim. In the verse mentioned above we see the ten tribes being replanted on the mountains of Israel. Do you have a problem with that? Yahuwah doesn't! You see our vision is too small. Our vision must be the vision of Yahshua and the 12 disciples and must include a revival among all Israel, not just 2/12th's of Israel!! It was Yahshua Himself who promised the twelve talmidim a millennial rule over twelve verifiable and recognizable tribes of re-gathered millennial Israel (Matthew 19:28). Zechariah in chapter 8:22-23, specifically refers to ten men representing the ten returning tribes grabbing the tzitzit (fringes) of a Jew who has come to know Yahshua personally and declaring that they will also return to Zion and Torah. Notice that these ten returning men speak all of the world's known languages. In this passage we see the ongoing return of all Israel, to Israel!

In Yaakov (James) 1:1 Yaakov writes his epistle to the 12 tribes scattered abroad. Obviously James knew that the body of Yahshua that he was writing to was nothing more than the re-gathered 12 tribes of Israel that had been redeemed through Yahshua and he addressed them as such! If the ten tribes remained lost and nowhere to be found why would James write to them and call them brethren of faith in verse 2 of James chapter One? Obviously he had no problem with the body of Yahshua being New Covenant Israel made up of all twelve tribes and perhaps some very few exceptions. Have you ever written a post card to people that had disappeared from the earth or didn't exist? Obviously they had to exist in order to be written to and to be addressed.

Was it just Yahshua & James that had this revelation? In I Peter 1:1, Keefa writes to the chosen people living in the Diaspora. The Jewish Diaspora did not happen until 20 years after this epistle was penned in about 50 AD. Yet he refers to these other ten tribes' descendants who have come to faith as "the chosen people". Could it be that Ephraim is just as chosen as Judah? Does that burst your bubble? Poor thing! You thought that only two tribes (Jews) were chosen. The scriptures never once calls the Jewish people chosen. Rather it calls all Israel, of which the Jews are but two parts, the chosen people! Jeremiah 33:24 confirms this truth. Yahuwah states that he has chosen two houses or two clans or two nations! Got that! That is the House Of Israel and the House Of Judah. Peter wrote to the re-gathered House of Israel when addressing his epistle! You want some more New Covenant proof texts that these folks calling themselves Christians are nothing more than the physical descendants of the ten lost tribes? No problem. In First Keefa (Peter) chapter 2 verses 8-10 we see Peter quoting Hosea chapter One. The people who are a royal priesthood a chosen generation and a holy nation are identified by Keefa as nothing more than the former lo-ami and lo-ruhammah of Hosea chapter One! In verse 11 of First Keefa chapter 2, Peter says: You who are now New Covenant Priests and New Covenant Israel once were not a people (lo-ami) and had not obtained compassion and mercy (lo-ruhammah).But now through Yahshua you are restored to a people called ami and receiving ruhammah. This is a clear and direct reference attributing and labeling the body of Yahshua as containing much of the old northern kingdom of Ephraim returning because of Yahuwah's favor through the blood of Messiah.

Did Rav Shaul (Paul) also understand the re-gathering of the twelve tribes of Israel through Yahuwah's Son? Was he able to identify "Christians" in Rome as nothing more than the former House of Ephraim? You bet he did. In Romans chapter 9 verse 24 Rav Shaul states that Yahuwah calls Jews and Gentiles to make up His body as heirs of eternal life. Then in verse 25 of Romans 9 he quotes Hosea chapter One and identifies the born again redeemed Gentiles of his day as the Old Covenant House of Israel (Ephraim). He quotes the lo-ami passage of Hosea One and attributes this to "saved Gentiles". Verses 25 & 26 boldly declares this. Finally in verse 27 he puts the icing on the cake and declares that these "saved Gentiles" not only are the former house of Israel that became the "fullness of the Gentiles", but he even quotes Isaiah stating that out of the entire "sand of the sea" promise to Ephraim regarding physical multiplicity only a remnant of Israelites from all twelve tribes will be saved. Wow! Notice the transition and progression as the saved Gentiles of verse 24 in Romans 9 wind up being identified by Paul as the former house of Israel (ten tribes) spoken of by Isaiah, in the next two verses.

In Ephesians 2:11 Rav Shaul declares that those who got saved as Gentiles are no longer Gentiles! They have a new identity, and that identity is according to verse 12 a citizenship in the commonwealth of Israel. They are Israelites! You cannot be a citizen of a spiritual entity known as "the church" or any other spiritual entity. In order to be a physical citizen of the commonwealth of Massachusetts you have to be a physical being. In order for former Gentiles who by virtue of their acceptance of Messiah have become physical citizens of the house and commonwealth of Israel they must be and in fact are physical Israelites from a different side of the family than Messianic Jews. Verse 19 nails this down for us as Rav Shaul declares that these folks are no longer strangers to the house of Israel but fellow citizens. Citizenship always has been and always will be something on the physical plain. In Galatians 3:29 Rav Shaul refers to born again non Jews as the seed or sperma of Abraham. Now let me ask you an honest question! Does the Greek word for seed (sperma), from where we get the English word sperm, sound like something spiritual or something very physical? Therefore if you belong to Messiah through the new birth, regardless of who you think you are, you are Abraham's sperm! That's why verse 28 says there are no Jews, Greeks men or women there is only Abraham's physical seed that has been redeemed and should be known as new covenant Israel!

Further proof is found in Galatians 4:28 where Rav Shaul refers to non Jewish believers as being exactly like Isaac -- the heir of the physical promise of multiplicity. Was Isaac a physical being or just a spiritual being? He was a spirit-filled-and-led physical being! According to Rav Shaul, that is exactly who the non-Jewish believers are in the New Covenant! In First Corinthians 10:1 Rav Shaul reminds saved Ephraimites that they were once Gentiles, but not any longer. He reminds these non-Jewish Israelites that their fathers (Hebrews) who were led out of Egypt went through the Red Sea and eventually met the Rock (Messiah) just as they had (First Corinthians 10:1-4). In First Corinthians 5:7-8 we see these Ephraimite Israelites keeping Pesach! Only the people of Israel celebrate the Feasts Of Israel!

There are man-made teachings and teachers that place the word "spiritual" in front of the word "fathers" in First Corinthians 10:1 as well as Galatians 3:29 where they add the word "spiritual" before the word "seed", to make it seem as if Christians are only some kind of spiritual seed, or worse yet something called "spiritual Jews." May I remind these teachers that adding to the Word of Yahuwah is a capital offence punishable by death (Proverbs 30:5, Deut. 4:2, Deut.12:32, Rev 22:18). Apparently there are some who either do not understand this truth or who do understand it, but desire to continue to suppress it so that they can keep "saved Ephraimites" in perpetual second class adopted chains worshiping at the throne of Judaism instead of His Son. If non-Jewish believers were totally honest with themselves, most of them carry a deep desire and therefore inner jealousy to be Jewish. That jealousy either causes them to want to convert to any kind of Judaism, even those forms that force a recanting of faith in Yahshua's finished work, or historically the jealousy has and can still turn into raging hatred against the Jew they can never become. Those days are over! This is the day divinely decreed for the restoration of all things (Acts 3:20-21). When Ephraim begins to believe that they are part of physical Israel they will act like Israelites and return to Shabbat, kashrut, moedim, Zionism and aliyah, and will cease to be jealous of the Jews (Isaiah 11:12-14). According to these same verses the day is coming when Jews will recognize Ephraim as their physical brothers in much the same way that all Jacob's sons came to recognize Joseph in Egypt. They thought he was a Gentile and all the while Joseph was an Israelite. Whether Judah recognizes born-again non-Jews as Ephraim does not change the fact that they, like Joseph, are unrecognizable to their brothers. Yet still like Joseph, Ephraim is Joseph's son and Jacob's grandson and is in fact an Israelite experiencing the same lack of recognition that his father Joseph experienced in Egypt. Joseph knew them but they knew not Joseph. Today large segments of Ephraim recognizes chosen, born-again Judah, yet Judah cannot and often will not recognize born-again Ephraim! Yahuwah declares that this vexation of Ephraim by Judah will come to an end through Messiah (Isaiah 11:13-14), when He gathers the outcasts of Israel and the dispersed of Judah from all the earth. Notice how Judah was never outcast like Ephraim, only dispersed.

In Yochanan 10:16 Yahshua said "other sheep I have which are not of this fold. I have to bring them in as well. And they shall hear my voice and there shall be one flock and one shepherd". Notice that Yahshua had another Israelite flock that were still His fold even before He died and arose again. He did not say that he will create a new and separate fold called "the church" made up of pagans with separate practices replacing Torah sometime after His resurrection. He said that He already had two folds -- that He was sent to bring them in, and they will become one flock or one united house.

John (Yochanan) knew the same truth by virtue of his writings in Yochanan (11:49-52). John stated that when Ciaphas prophesied that it was good that Yahshua was dying for Judah, John added that Ciaphas was prophesying that Yahshua would not only die for that nation (Judah), but also the former house of Israel that were scattered abroad 721 years prior to Yahshua's birth! We know this is a reference to the House of Israel (ten tribes) since he calls them a nation (physical people), as well as children of Elohim! They were called children of Israel because Elohim is the Elohim of Israel and they were Israel or children of Elohim even before Yahshua went to the tree of Korban! Notice that the Father's' revealed plan in verse 52 of chapter 11 of John is to gather both nations or houses into one. Even at the time of Yahshua, people's eyes and hearts were being opened to the truth about the family feud perpetuated by Jacob widened by Jeroboam and Rehoboam and in the last two millennia inflamed by the Church vs. Jewish battle royal over the title of who is Israel! The question is fully answered when one realizes that there is only one people of Israel with one Elohim of Israel and one Messiah of Israel and one Torah of Israel and that both houses need to follow the same blueprint for the restoration of all Israel on a level playing field of common ground. Only with the full understanding of the divided two houses of Israel, will the hatred, bitterness, pride and arrogance of Christendom and Judaism towards each other come to a quick and deserving death. Any other solution to the Church vs. Jewish debate will result in more misunderstanding between brethren and the perpetuation of the family feud started by Jacob splitting the birthright between Ephraim and Judah though both were physical and spiritual Israel.

It is comforting to note that according to Isaiah 49 verses 1-6 the Messiah is promised to all Israel and is even referred to as Israel, since Israel's restoration is the personification and primary purpose of His mission. Hosea 11:1 also calls The Messiah, Israel! In Isaiah 49 verse six, we see the Father asking Him if He is prepared to raise up the twelve tribes of Israel by bringing back into the fold those who, though scattered and lost as a nation, would be individually preserved in and amongst the Gentiles in the four corners of the earth for the Messiah's ministry. He did come. He did go looking for preserved individuals physically descended from Ephraim and Judah and has in fact restored these preserved ones. Though these preserved ones may not know who they are, though they may look, act, smell, behave and conduct themselves with all of their father Jeroboam's filthy ways, our Messiah knew where to locate them. He has located them and He has brought them back to the fold on an individual basis not a national basis, as of yet. Interestingly enough the Hebrew word for preserved ones in Isaiah 49:6 is Notzrim or Nazarenes, which is the modern Hebrew word for Christians. It is these preserved born again Ephraimites that would be re-gathered in to the rebuilt Tabernacle of David and would return to the fold of Israel as Nazarenes. Let us recall that the entire early Messianic communities were known as The Nazarenes (Acts 24:5), the preserved ones of returning repentant Israel!
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:43 pm

so.......lilly.........whaddaya think about that? You & Tinnytintin know shit about shinola..........

wave
http://yourarmstoisrael.org/Articles_new/restoration/?page=2&type=12


Read this thumbs up

PART TWO IN A SERIES ON THE FULL RESTORATION OF ALL ISRAEL

In order to conclusively determine the makeup of the New Covenant body of Yahshua called the Israel of Yahuwah in Galatians 6:16, we have to understand several crucial truths. We must understand that the twin dispersions of both houses of Israel, Ephraim in the north and Judah in the south was not only a punitive decision by Yahuwah, but one of faithfulness as well. In Genesis 13:14-16, Genesis 17:4 -5, Genesis 26: 4, Genesis 48:19, along with a host of other texts the patriarchs were promised the physical blessing of physical multiplicity that would see their physical sperm or zera fill the globe. Prior to the northern kingdom's dispersion, beginning with Tiglath Pileser III in 745 BCE and culminating in Sargon II's final conquest of the northern capital of Samaria in 721BCE, scripture teaches that many from Judah in the south migrated northward and many from Ephraim in the north, in order to escape capture migrated to the South. Therefore both houses of Israel most likely contained representative samplings of all twelve tribes but not the full numbers within the twelve tribes themselves. When the northern kingdom went into Diaspora due to paganism, idolatry and Torah breaking, they followed a northwest route taking them to parts of Assyria. Later according to history these Assyrian towns became part of the Scythian peoples who eventually settled in Europe and the west. Since these ten tribes had no interest in protecting their Israelite identity they tossed it to the wind and literally became Gentiles. First Kings 12:24 reminds us that this 721 BCE Israelite holocaust, was the divinely mandated plan of Yahuwah for the intermingling of Israelite blood throughout the globe. Yahuwah decided to accomplish this plan to fulfill covenant faithfulness to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob by allowing first the northern kingdom and later the southern kingdom to both experience diaspora and global scattering. Since there was this dramatic crossover and migration prior to 721BCE by the time both houses would be scattered globally each house contained a representation of all twelve tribes. This is not to say however that all within those twelve tribes can be found in either the Judahite people or in the Ephraimite people. What can be said is that when Judah was dispersed first in 520BCE and later in 70 CE they were far more careful to preserve their culture, customs and their beloved Torah to which they remained generally faithful. Therefore no matter where either house went globally they would carry Israelite blood and seed to all creation and almost every creature. It had to be this way since the patriarchal promises of physical multiplicity were promised to be fulfilled through the Ephraim side of the family in Genesis 48:19, not through Judah. Judah rather was given the privilege, preeminence and honor of being the vehicle through which Shiloh the Messiah would be made manifest.

Thus according to Matthew 10:23 as prophesied by Yahshua every city on the globe would become a city of Israel, since many if not most of its inhabitants would be made up of large populations of those descended from both houses. In this same verse Yahshua confirms this amazing truth when He both prophecies and reminds His talmidim that they will have so much area to cover in their mission that when the Son Of Man returns, they will still be busy preaching the gospel. This area He talks about must be global in scope since the twelve shilichim (apostles), could have covered all of Judea in less than a couple of years or a couple of decades at the most. Remember that Judea was about the same size as Rhode Island and that Bethlehem was and still is only five miles south of Jerusalem. Yet Yahshua prepares them for a major task that will be so global in character that they will not have the opportunity to finish this kingdom business when He returns. "Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel before the Son Of Man be come". In other words Paris, London, Hong Kong, Tehran, Beirut, Tokyo, New York, Boston, Philadelphia etc., are all considered cities of Israel by our Heavenly Father. When you combine this powerful truth along with Matthew 15:24 where Yahshua Himself states that He only came for the lost sheep of the House Of Israel, we have strong evidence that the globe is "His Israel". Of course we balance this scripture with others stating how the Son would save the whole world that He came to die for. If He died for the whole world and if He only came for lost sheep of Israel, simple logic will tell you that the globe as it now stands today 2700 years after Ephraim’s diaspora and 2000 years after Judah’s last diaspora is made up largely of Israelite blood. Notice that I did not say Jewish blood, since most of the Jewish nation remained small and never really multiplied physically due to holocausts, inquisitions, extermination attempts and genocide. We must be careful not to continue to use confusing terminology.

Ephraim Israel on the other hand loved to assimilate and copy the ways of the heathen so they were not as easily detected and could not be identified for persecution and annihilation. They were more than happy to integrate and assimilate into any society they happened to find themselves in. It is through this carefree attitude towards Yahuwah and His Torah that actually aided Yahuwah in fulfilling the promise of Genesis 48:19. This yielding up of their Israelite heritage allowed Ephraimite blood to multiply and spread globally undetected, largely escaping the persecution and tribulations that have historically been associated with openly demonstrative Judah. O the depths and the wisdom of the Almighty. How marvelous and unsearchable are His ways, past finding out.

It is evident to most serious students of the Bible that Yahshua of Nazareth being Israel’s real Messiah has done exactly what He said he would do and has been regathering all Israel, the chosen remnant of both houses right under our noses, while we have been sleeping and arguing about who has Jewish blood. Just like Adam woke up from a deep sleep to find his bride Chava next to him, so will Jewish Israel soon wake up to find their beloved long lost brother Joseph, who has been heretofore unrecognizable right next to him! Ephraim Israel was divinely sent ahead to provide gospel provision and spiritual manna for the last two thousand years. In order for Yahshua to regather both Jewish Israel and Ephraim Israel, He had to allow Judah to maintain identity lest they be consumed and Messiah’s birth prevented and at the same time literally turn the descendents of Jeroboam the Ephraimite into pagan Gentiles. That is correct. The lost sheep of the house of Ephraim became pagan Gentiles. That is why over and over again in the Brit Chadashah the epistles refer to Gentiles getting saved. Gentiles being born again. Gentiles being washed in the blood. Gentiles, Gentiles, Gentiles! I am so tired of answering the same question over and over again -- "If the ten tribes became Gentiles, why doesn’t the Brit Chadasha say that the body of Yahshua is made up of Judahites and Ephraimites instead of Jews and Gentiles?" I’ll tell you why! It is because the authors of the New Covenant took it for granted that those who follow Israelite history and have done their homework, would be well aware of the historicity behind the ten tribes and their subsequent assimilation that has led to their becoming Gentiles. These New Covenant authors simply took it for granted that you would know who most Gentiles were formerly. The burden of studious verification is on you not anyone else!

In the last issue we gave ample evidence that this truth is not only hinted at, but strongly addressed in Brit Chadasha. In James 1:1 and Acts 15:14-19, and many other scriptures which clearly talk about Yahuwah not wanting to hang out or take up residence with the heathen nations, but states that He is visiting them to pull off a massive rescue and return to Himself, of the people belonging to and already called by His Name (Acts 15:14).Yaakov states that all the prophets of Israel agree that the primary purpose of the New Covenant and Israel’s Messiah is to redeem and return all the seed of Israel from both houses back into the Tabernacle Of David which had fallen. Obviously it fell due to division. Verse 16 of Acts 15 teaches us that Yahuwah is not doing something new by building a manmade church headquartered in Rome nor is He building a church where Gentiles will outnumber, surpass and suppress Jewish expression, rather that He is returning Davidic 12 tribe glory to Israel. He is rebuilding not building. In order to rebuild you must of necessity use the same inhabitants of David’s Tabernacle (all twelve tribes) to rebuild it, in order for it to resemble it’s former makeup and appearance. Verse 20 of Acts 15 states that those who are making up the rebuilt Tabernacle are those returning to Yahuwah. The Greek word in verse 20 is returning and these Ephraimites are returning because their Israelite Ephraimite ancestors left and forsook the Father of glory. Can it be any simpler? Once we can determine conclusively from scripture that multitudes of those coming into the body of Yahshua are bloodline descendents of the northern kingdom, then we will be forced to readjust our thinking in the Messianic movement. Just because we cannot recognize the house of Joseph as being from our own family and amongst us, doesn’t mean they are not. Joseph dressed like an Egyptian was married to a pagan priestess with a pagan name having pagan children which were unrecognizable to his brethren. The situation has not changed one iota. No matter how much denial proceeds from the camp of Judah the fact remains unchanged that those we call saved Gentiles or non Jews are in many cases our brother Yosef who fathered Ephraim the pagan in Egypt, as well as the masses of returning Ephraimite pagans resulting from the first Israelite holocaust in 721 BCE. It was this dual dispersion of both houses that has both fulfilled the promise of physical multiplicity and magnified Yahshua’s greatness as the only one who can find and locate both houses, both containing representation of all 12 tribes, both needing restoration to Yahuwah and to the land.

Isaiah 49:6 is an amazing piece of Messianic scripture. In verse five it states that one of the reasons that the Father birthed Yahshua is to bring Jacob back. Not Jews only, but Jacob. Verse six of Isaiah 49 is even more profound. It prophecies that Messiah will raise up the tribes of Israel. To raise up means to make reappear or to restore back to recognizable life. He will bring life by restoring the desolate parts. What part or parts of Israel that had experienced Davidic glory had become the most desolate? That’s right! Ephraim did! Isaiah 11:12 confirms that while Judah was merely scattered it was Ephraim Israel that became the desolate part or the outcasts of Israel. Isaiah 11:10 claims that Messiah the Root of Jesse and Branch of David will do this regathering of both dispersed (Jewish) Israel as well as outcast (Ephraim) Israel. If Yahshua can differentiate between the two houses that were exiled in two different directions some 200 years apart, why can’t we? If Yahshua is not gathering both houses from both diasporas then He is a false Messiah! Of course we know He is the Messiah therefore He is regathering both houses.

In verse 6 of Isaiah 49 Ephraim is called the preserved ones of Israel. The beginning of these potent verses reminds us that Almighty Yahuwah is so omnipotent that what we consider an impossible task is such a light and small matter in the scope of eternity for the omniscient and omnipotent Messiah, that the Father has also given Him the true non Israelite Gentiles with no Israelite blood as His possession just so He doesn’t get bored with His task!

Messianic Judaism needs to make the break with the fears of the past and recognize the dawn of a new day where in Yahshua, Joseph our brother is sitting and dwelling with us and next to us. It is this recognition of our hidden brethren that will bring about not only the salvation of all Israel but an overnight mushrooming of this still small movement. This next step of growth can only come by accepting as authentic the claims of those who claim Israelite heritage, and are frankly willing to admit that they are not Jews, whose sole desire is to share in the destiny of Jewish Israel along with the good the bad and the oftentimes ugly aspects of being an Israelite.

If Yahshua is radiating His gospel all across the globe and bringing in all humanity in these last days global harvest from among the nations, then somewhere in that vast net there are hundreds of thousands even untold millions of descendents of Joseph and Ephraim who unknown to even themselves are returning to their Judahite brothers. You cannot have a final last days global Tikun Ha Olam without somewhere in that huge global harvest finding and coming across large amounts of the lost sheep of the northern house of Israel. That would be a logical, historical, cultural and mathematical impossibility! Remember that as believers it is up to us to line up our doctrine with Yahshua’s not His with ours or our organization’s doctrinal statement of faith, whatever form that may take. If we can all agree that amongst the nations of the world there is to be found that scattered "zera" of both Jewish Israel and Ephraim Israel, then we now have that common ground and common vision that beats simultaneously to that of the Heavenly Father’s heartbeat for all Israel. Just because we in our finite mortality cannot identify these non Jewish Israelites, does not mean that they disappeared off the face of the earth and does not mean that they are not showing up weekly in our midst and in our congregations and in our synagogues whether we like it or not. Shaking our collective heads in doctrinal disagreement with Your Arms To Israel will not make them go away. In Jeremiah 31:9&10, the Father cries out to all with ears to hear that Ephraim is HIS SON AND FIRSTBORN and will gather him again! It is Yahshua who is restoring the Kingdom to Israel one soul at a time and eventually in large masses. This massive Ephraimite assembling process results in the formation of the general assembly and congregation of "the first born", mentioned by Rav Shaul himself in Hebrews 12:23. He recognized that many in New Covenant Israel were of the lineage of Ephraim, the first born and therefore a congregation of firstborns. Notice the present tense backdrop for this scripture! This process is ongoing in the here and now even as it was already underway in Rav Shaul’s day. This task could not and cannot be undertaken by any movement of man no matter how well intentioned such as Jewish or even Christian Zionism. It is a job that only omnipotent Moshiach can and has been performing!

That is what I believe the so called rapture is all about. Let’s be honest here. How many born again non-Jewish believers do you see lining up at the Israeli consulate waiting in line for visas to make aliyah to Israel? Not even most Jewish Israelites do that. So how can the Father bring to pass all those promises that no Israelites will be left behind in any of the nations where He has scattered both houses. Ezekiel 39:28 talking about not a single Israelite living anywhere outside Israel during the millennium. Think about that promise! If one Israelite remains anywhere outside Israel then Yahuwah lied. He said not one would be left behind. To me and my small way of thinking that can only happen by virtue of the "catching away", where millions of Methodists, Baptists, Presbyterians, Nazarenes and other regathered born again folk, are supernaturally caught up and airlifted to Israel on His Almighty wings to, be returned to their land forever more. Why would these folks plan aliyah since their Israelite identity is lost to themselves as well. Most have no desire to return. Yes, I believe in the rapture of all Israel, but not in the rapture of something called the church as it is commonly taught. In that version or should I say perversion, the Jews get zonked and the "so called " saved Gentiles" get a seven year heavenly cruise vacation. That perversion of the rapture is pure poppycock and for those waiting for that kind of rapture bus to show up pre tribulationally, you will not only be sorely disappointed and misled, but I urge you to bring your jacket and sleeping bag. It is guaranteed to be a long wait for a pre-tribulation rapture bus that will never show up! It just won’t happen the way many of our readers want it to. That falsehood would further separate New Covenant Israel instead of rebuilding it, since the main thrust of that teaching is to have the Roman Church and her daughter hookers fly away unscathed while the "Jewish Christ killers" get zonked. The church and her Roman Pontiff fly to heaven while Jewish Israel is left behind. However if Yahshua’s New Covenant bride is born again Israel, then Jews escape as well! I see from scripture that there will be a bona fide snatching away, of redeemed blood washed New Covenant Israelites made up of Jews, Ephraimites and Gentiles as well, all returning to the mountains of our beloved homeland. The correct view of the rapture is to remove all of New Covenant Israel away from Yahuwah’s wrath only to later return in mass to Israel without remaining in heaven, though as glorified beings we will have free access to the heavens as and whenever we desire.
Verse 25 of Ezekiel 39 tells us that the whole house of Israel meaning the entire captivity of Jacob will return. When Yahuwah uses the term Jacob it talks about both houses coming home along with their Gentile companions................................................

See lilly? Cherry picking verses out of context is deceptive and misleading.....you have been totally/thoroughly refuted.. thumbs up
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Fri Sep 02, 2011 2:23 pm

el kabong wrote:Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia thumbs up

Europe is a LARGER Continent then Australia. As a matter of FACT; Australia is the SMALLEST/RUNT Continent. And as large it may be, the size of your EGO makes it uncomfortably confining. But hey, that's only one of your many lies and deceptions. Let's talk about Mizraim, the Hebrew word for Egypt. You say it isn't. Where is your credentialed support for your ignorant nonsense? thumbs up

http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Mizraim.html

Meaning and etymology of the name Mizraim
Mizraim


Mizraim is a son of Ham, son of Noah (Genesis 12:10). This name is also the common name for Egypt (which is also known as 'the land of Ham,', for instance in Psalm 105:23).

Egypt was known by the names Musuru, Musru, Misir or Masri in other languages, and Mizraim is probably simply a phonetic transliteration into Hebrew of any of them. The word looks identical to what a dual form of would look like (see below). This duality possibly helped to denote Upper and Lower Egypt. The word for Egyptian is .

The similar (masor), a poetic nickname for Egypt that is used on three different occasions (Isaiah 19:6, 2 Kings 19:24 = Isaiah 37:25, Micah 7:12), may shed some understanding on how a Hebrew audience might have interpreted the name Mizraim.

The noun (masor) means siege, entrenchment, and it derives from the verb (sur), bind, besiege. Another derivation of this same verb is the noun , stronghold. HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament notes that a stronghold or walled city may be an instrument of protection during the first stages of a war, but will turn into a lethal trap if a siege last long. A beautiful figurative use of this word occurs in Psalm 31:21, where the author compares himself under siege by his troubles.

The verb from which the noun derives, is part of a group of five different roots. These roots all have different linguistic sources but were perhaps readily incorporated into the Hebrew language due to similar or related meanings, more or less:
(swr) is the assumed root of the words (sawwar), neck and (sawwaron), necklace. The neck is simply a part of the body, but figuratively it is used as seat of strength (Job 39:19) and subsequently as target of defeat (by the placing of the victor's foot on the neck of the conquered - Joshua 10:24). The similarity between a necklace and a besieging army is obvious.
The verb (sur) means to bind or besiege; referred to above.
The verb (sur) means show hostility to, be an adversary. According to BDB Theological Dictionary and HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is probably a by-form of (sarar), see below.
The verb (sur) means to form or fashion. According to HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is possibly a by-form of (yasar), form or fashion.
The noun (sur) does not occur in the Bible, but is probably related to words in cognate languages that mean rock or hill. A derivative that does occur in the Bible is (sur), the common Biblical word for rock. BDB Theological Dictionary suggests relations with (sara), see below.

The words and are linguistically closely related. Their respective meanings also shows much kinship:
The verb (sarar) means to bind, be narrow/ confined, be in distress. Derivatives are: (sar), narrow, tight; (sar), distress; (sara), straights, distress; (sarar), suffer distress; (seror), bundle; (mesar), straights, distress. The latter word written in a dual form would yield the name , Mizraim. Jones' Dictionary of Old Testament Proper Names assumed that this is what Mizraim would have meant to a Hebrew audience and reads Double Distress.
The verb (sarar) means show hostility towards. Derivation (sar) means adversary.
The assumed root (srr) is unused in the Bible but in Arabic it means be sharp. Its common derivative is (sar), pebble, flint.

The name Mizraim means Double Distress or Double Stronghold.



Bible Dictionary

Mizraim definition


the dual form of matzor, meaning a "mound" or "fortress," the name of a people descended from Ham (Gen. 10:6, 13; 1 Chr. 1:8, 11). It was the name generally given by the Hebrews to the land of Egypt (q.v.), and may denote the two Egypts, the Upper and the Lower. The modern Arabic name for Egypt is Muzr.


Mizraim From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mizraim
Mizraim (Hebrew: מִצְרַיִם / מִצְרָיִם, Modern Mitzráyim Tiberian Miṣrāyim / Miṣráyim ; cf. Arabic مصر, Miṣr) is the Hebrew name for the land of Egypt, with the dual suffix -āyim, perhaps referring to the "two Egypts": Upper Egypt and Lower Egypt.

Ugaritic inscriptions refer to Egypt as Msrm, in the Amarna tablets it is called Misri, and Assyrian and Babylonian records called Egypt Musur and Musri. The Arabic word for Egypt is Misr (pronounced Masr in Egyptian colloquial Arabic), and Egypt's official name is Gumhuriyah Misr al-'Arabiyah (the Arab Republic of Egypt).

According to Genesis 10, Mizraim (a son of Ham) was the younger brother of Cush and elder brother of Phut and Canaan, whose families together made up the Hamite branch of Noah's descendants. Mizraim's sons were Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, Casluhim (out of whom came Philistim), and Caphtorim.[1]

According to Eusebius' Chronicon, Manetho had suggested that the great age of antiquity in which the later Egyptians boasted had actually preceded the flood, and that they were really descended from Mizraim, who settled there anew. A similar story is related by medieval Islamic historians such as Sibt ibn al-Jawzi, the Egyptian Ibn Abd-el-Hakem, and the Persians al-Tabari and Muhammad Khwandamir, stating that the pyramids, etc. had been built by the wicked races before the deluge, but that Noah's descendant Mizraim (Masar or Mesr) was entrusted with reoccupying the region afterward. The Islamic accounts also make Masar the son of a Bansar or Beisar and grandson of Ham, rather than a direct son of Ham, and add that he lived to the age of 700. Some scholars think it likely that Mizraim is a dual form of the word Misr meaning "land", and was translated literally into Ancient Egyptian as Ta-Wy (the Two Lands) by early pharaohs at Thebes, who later founded the Middle Kingdom.

But according to George Syncellus, the Book of Sothis, supposedly by Manetho, had identified Mizraim with the legendary first pharaoh Menes, said to have unified the Old Kingdom and built Memphis. Misraim also seems to correspond to Misor, said in Phoenician mythology to have been father of Taautus who was given Egypt, and later scholars noticed that this also recalls Menes, whose son or successor was said to be Athothis.

In Judaism, Mitzrayim has been connected with the word meitzar (מיצר), meaning "sea strait", possibly alluding to narrow gulfs from both sides of Sinai peninsula. It also can mean "boundaries, limits, restrictions" or "narrow place".[citation needed]

However, author David Rohl has suggested a different interpretation: "Amongst the followers of Meskiagkasher [Cush] was his younger 'brother' -- in his own right a strong and charismatic leader of men. He is the head of the falcon tribe -- the descendants of Horus the 'Far Distant'. The Bible calls this new Horus-king 'Mizraim' but this name is, in reality, no more than an epithet. It means 'follower of Asr' or 'Asar' (Arabic m-asr with the Egyptian preposition m 'from'). Mizraim is merely m-Izra with the majestic plural ending 'im'. Likewise, that other great Semitic-speaking people -- the Assyrians -- called the country of the pharaohs 'Musri' (m-Usri)." [2]


Genesis 10 - The Table of Nations
http://www.enduringword.com/commentaries/0110.htm
The tenth chapter of Genesis . . . stands absolutely alone in ancient literature, without a remote parallel, even among the Greeks, where we find the closest approach to a distribution of peoples in genealogical framework . . . The Table of Nations remains an astonishing accurate document. (William F. Albright, cited in Boice)

A. The descendants of Japheth.

1. (1) The three sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

Now this is the genealogy of the sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth. And sons were born to them after the flood.

2. (2) The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

The sons of Japheth were Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

a. The sons of Japheth: He was the father of the Indo-European peoples, those stretching from India to the shores of Western Europe. They are each linked by linguistic similarities that often seem invisible to the layman but are much more obvious to the linguist.

b. Gomer: From this son of Japheth came the Germanic peoples, from whom came most of the original peoples of Western Europe. These include the original French, Spanish, and Celtic settlers.

c. Magog . . . Tubal, Meshech: These settled in the far north of Europe and became the Russian peoples.

d. Madai: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Medes and they populated what are now Iran and Iraq. The peoples of India also came from this branch of Japheth’s family.

e. Javan: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Greeks, whose sea-faring ways are described in Genesis 10:5.

3. (3) The sons of Gomer.

The sons of Gomer were Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah.

a. Ashkenaz: From this son of Gomer came the peoples who settled north of Judea into what we call the Fertile Crescent.

b. Togarmah: From this son of Gomer came the Armenians.

4. (4-5) The sons of Javan (the ancient Greeks).

The sons of Javan were Elishah, Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim. From these the coastland peoples of the Gentiles were separated into their lands, everyone according to his language, according to their families, into their nations.

a. The sons of Javan were: Geographic names that spring from these names in this chapter abound. Linguists have no trouble seeing the connection between Kittim and Cyprus, Rodanim and Rhodes, Gomer and Germany, Meschech and Moscow, Tubal and Tobolsk.

B. The descendants of Ham.

1. (6) The sons of Ham: Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

The sons of Ham were Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

a. Ham: The descendants of Ham are the peoples who populated Africa and the Far East.

b. Cush: Apparently, this family divided into two branches early. Some founded Babylon (notably, Nimrod) and others founded Ethiopia.

c. Mizraim: This is another way the Bible refers to Egypt. Put refers to Libya, the region of North Africa west of Egypt. Canaan refers to the peoples who originally settled the land we today think of as Israel and its surrounding regions.
2. (7-12) The sons of Cush.

The sons of Cush were Seba, Havilah, Sabtah, Raamah, and Sabtechah; and the sons of Raamah were Sheba and Dedan. Cush begot Nimrod; he began to be a mighty one on the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord; therefore it is said, “Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord.” And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, Erech, Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar. From that land he went to Assyria and built Nineveh, Rehoboth Ir, Calah, and Resen between Nineveh and Calah (that is the principal city).



a. Cush begot Nimrod: One son of Cush worthy of note is Nimrod. He was a mighty one on the earth, but not in a good way. He ruled over Babel, which was the first organized rebellion of humans against God. The name Nimrod itself means, “let us rebel.”



b. Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord: The context shows that this is not a compliment of Nimrod. The idea is that Nimrod was an offense before the face of God.



i. “This is not talking about Nimrod’s ability to hunt wild game. He was not a hunter of animals. He was a hunter of men - a warrior. It was through his ability to fight and kill and rule ruthlessly that his kingdom of the Euphrates valley city states was consolidated.” (Boice)



ii. A Jerusalem Targum says: “He was powerful in hunting and in wickedness before the Lord, for he was a hunter of the sons of men, and he said to them, ‘Depart from the judgment of the Lord, and adhere to the judgment of Nimrod!’ Therefore it is said: ‘As Nimrod the strong one, strong in hunting, and in wickedness before the Lord.’ ”



iii. Ginzberg quotes from a Jewish legend: “The great success that attended all of Nimrod’s undertakings produced a sinister effect. Men no longer trusted in God, but rather in their own prowess and ability, an attitude to which Nimrod tried to convert the whole world.”

iv. “Hence it is likely that Nimrod, having acquired power, used it in tyranny and oppression; and by rapine and violence founded the domination which was the first distinguished by the name of a kingdom on the face of the earth. How many kingdoms have been founded in the same way, in various ages and nations from that time to the present! From the Nimrods of the earth, God deliver the world!” (Clarke)

3. (13-14) The sons of Mizraim.

Mizraim begot Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, and Casluhim (from whom came the Philistines and Caphtorim).

4. (15-19) The sons of Canaan.

Canaan begot Sidon his firstborn, and Heth; the Jebusite, the Amorite, and the Girgashite; the Hivite, the Arkite, and the Sinite; the Arvadite, the Zemarite, and the Hamathite. Afterward the families of the Canaanites were dispersed. And the border of the Canaanites was from Sidon as you go toward Gerar, as far as Gaza; then as you go toward Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboiim, as far as Lasha.

a. Canaan begot Sidon: The family of Sidon, the son of Canaan, went north and is related to the Hittites and Lebanese.

b. And the Sinite: Many people believe the Oriental peoples descended from the Sinites.

5. (20) The spread of the descendants of Ham.

These were the sons of Ham, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands and in their nations.

C. The descendants of Shem.

1. (21-22) The sons of Shem: Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

And children were born also to Shem, the father of all the children of Eber, the brother of Japheth the elder. The sons of Shem were Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

a. Children were born also to Shem: From Shem comes Elam, who was an ancestor to the Persian peoples; Asshur, who was the father of the Assyrians; Lud was father to the Lydians who lived for a time in Asia Minor; and Aram was father to the Arameans, who we also know as the Syrians. Arphaxad was the ancestor to Abram and the Hebrews.

2. (23) The sons of Aram.

The sons of Aram were Uz, Hul, Gether, and Mash.

a. Uz: Later, a region in Arabia was named after this son of Aram.

Job came from the land of Uz (Job 1:1).

3. (24-30) The sons and descendants of Arphaxad.

Arphaxad begot Salah, and Salah begot Eber. To Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg, for in his days the earth was divided; and his brother’s name was Joktan. Joktan begot Almodad, Sheleph, Hazarmaveth, Jerah, Hadoram, Uzal, Diklah, Obal, Abimael, Sheba, Ophir, Havilah, and Jobab. All these were the sons of Joktan. And their dwelling place was from Mesha as you go toward Sephar, the mountain of the east.

a. All these were the sons of Joktan: The names under the son of Joktan (son of Eber, son of Salah, son of Arphaxad) are all associated with various Arabic peoples.

b. And Jobab: The one named Jobab may be the one we know as Job in the Old Testament.

4. (31) The spread of the descendants of Shem.

These were the sons of Shem, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands, according to their nations.
5. (32) Summary statement: the nations after the flood.

These were the families of the sons of Noah, according to their generations, in their nations; and from these the nations were divided on the earth after the flood.

a. “Hence one must consider this chapter of Genesis a mirror in which to discern that we human beings are, namely, creatures so marred by sin that we have no knowledge of our own origin, not even of God Himself, our Creator, unless the Word of God reveals these sparks of divine light to us from afar . . . This knowledge the Holy Scriptures reveal to us. Those who are without them live in error, uncertainty, and boundless ungodliness; for they have no knowledge about who they are and whence they came.” (Luther, cited in Boice)
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MIZRAIM = EGYPT

thumbs up popcorn

You also deceive about the Replacement/Superssessionism Theology......This is Strike 3 and a few more to go. thumbs up

http://www.biblestudyproject.org/israel3.1-replacement-theology-messianic.htm

The Truth

We believe Israel is God's special people, distinct from the body of Messiah, chosen by Him to be a holy nation and a Kingdom of priests. The election of Israel is irrevocable. . . . We believe the Abrahamic Covenant is an irrevocable, unconditional covenant God made with Jewish people. This covenant provides title to the land of Israel for the Jewish people and promises a descendant (the Messiah) who would come to redeem Israel and bless the entire world. The spiritual blessings of the Abrahamic Covenant overflow to all the nations. God will ultimately fulfill every aspect of the covenant in the Messianic Kingdom, both physical and spiritual. . . .
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Your LIE!!!!!!!

A. SUPERSESSIONISM OR REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY

The meaning of this doctrine is that the church superseded or replaced Israel as God's covenant people. The three claims presented under this heading are:
1. God has rejected Israel,
2. the church has replaced Israel as God's covenant people, and
3. the church is therefore spiritual Israel.

If God has rejected Israel, then that clears the way for a replacement people; and if that people is the church, then the church may be considered spiritual Israel. It is also conceivable that some who believe that Israel is still God's covenant people would consider the church spiritual Israel because it is composed of people whose spirits have been regenerated by the Holy Spirit. We will now hold the light of Scripture to these claims and possibilities.
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Paul follows his emphatic response with, for I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. . . . What is his point? If God had rejected Israel as His covenant people, then every Israelite would be disqualified from the possibility of being saved; yet he is an Israelite who is saved, and that proves that God has not rejected His people.

To sum up, we have noticed two proofs that God has not rejected Israel as His covenant people:
1. By the very meaning of May it never be! in the way that Paul used it in different contexts.
2. By the fact that Paul was a saved Israelite.


Nevertheless, we'll address several passages that need clarification.

b. Romans 11:1-5

1. I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2. God has not rejected His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says in the passage about Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel? 3. "Lord, THEY HAVE KILLED YOUR PROPHETS, THEY HAVE TORN DOWN YOUR ALTARS, AND I ALONE AM LEFT, AND THEY ARE SEEKING MY LIFE." 4. But what is the divine response to him? "I HAVE KEPT for Myself SEVEN THOUSAND MEN WHO HAVE NOT BOWED THE KNEE TO BAAL." 5. In the same way then, there has also come to be at the present time a remnant according to God's gracious choice.



Replacement Theology

Its Origins, Teachings and Errors

By Dr. Gary Hedrick, President of CJF Ministries

(With Minor Editing By Rabbi Loren)

http://www.shema.com/Combating%20Replacement%20Theology/crt-004.php

http://www.therefinersfire.org/replacement_theology.htm

These are serious errors/deformations in your Theology and Worldview. What do you have to say for yourself. You gibber on and on about being persecuted yet you, yourself; are the persecuter. You lie about the Jews and their Sacred scriptures and you attempt to steal their identity and destiny, without being able to read/write Hebrew. Your ignorance and hubris is appalling Capiche? thumbs up


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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:40 pm

true lilly wrote: rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin

but,

the way that you say it...[/i][/u][/color] [/size]

SEE! UNDERSTAND!
That The Word's have DIFFERENT,
DESCRIPTIVE, ROOT MEANINGS,
depending on The TIME, PLACE
and CONTEXT they are used,
and apply!

rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin

[/color]MANY GENERATIONS AFTER NOAH,
YET "YOU" ALL LIE
that NOAH
"was after The Land Divided"
and
"landed on the YET UNFORMED,
Mount Ararat
".

"YOU" ALL DENY THE WORD OF GOD,
to FORCE BELIEF IN "YOUR" FALSE,
INSANELY TOO SHORT,
"out of Egypt", "time-line".[/b][/color]

SEE, UNDERSTAND, that man's words,
like man, ARE LIMITED, whereas,
GOD IS LIMITLESS, like
THE FULL, DEEP, DESCRIPTIVE
ROOT MEANINGS of
EACH WORD of GOD'S WORD.
rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin


[size=24] Ahoy!!!! suzy woo woo!!!! lmao rolf Follow your own advice!!!! lmao rolf


The Kloo Store is open!!!!! The words you are talking about ORIGINALLY were scribed in Hebrew, at Sinai. Circa approximately 1,500 BCE............examine this authentic scientific Timeline............Notice, if you will when the Landmasses SEPARATED..........Notice if you will the Oxidization of the Atmosphere.......before you babble anymore nonsense acquire the Genesis Enigma by Andrew Parker......all you are doing is Antisemitic/judeophobic propaganda replacement bullshit...... ..


http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/timeline.html



Counting Backwards from Now

60 years ago - Invention of the computer.

130 years ago - Invention of the telephone.

180 years ago - Fossil fuel revolution: coal, trains.

540 years ago - Invention of the printing press.

5,500 years ago - Invention of the wheel, writing.

7,600 years ago - Sahara desert starts forming in northern Africa.

8,800 years ago - The first cities.

10,300 years ago - End of the most recent glacial period: the Wisconsin glaciation.

12,700 - 11,500 years ago - the Younger Dryas.

18,000 years ago - Cultivation of plants, herding of animals. Homo sapiens arrives in the Americas.

21,000 years ago - Last glacial maximum: ice sheets down to the Great Lakes, the mouth of the Rhine, and covering the British Isles.

32,000 years ago - Oldest known cave paintings.

35,000 years ago - Invention of the calendar, extinction of Homo neanderthalensis. Homo sapiens arrives in Europe.

50,000 years ago - Homo sapiens arrives in central Asia.

100,000 years ago - Homo sapiens arrives in the Middle East.

110,000 years ago - Beginning of the most recent glacial period: the Wisconsin glaciation.

130,000 years ago - Beginning of the Eemian interglacial.

200,000 years ago - Beginning of the 2nd most recent glacial period: the Wolstonian glaciation.

250,000 years ago - First Homo sapiens.

350,000 years ago - First Homo neanderthalensis.

380,000 years ago - Beginning of the Hoxnian interglacial.

450,000 years ago - Beginning of the 3rd most recent glacial period: the Kansan glaciation, during which ice sheets reached their maximum extent in the Pleistocene, down to Kansas and Slovakia.

620,000 years ago - Beginning of the Cromerian interglacial.

1.4 million years ago - First firemaking by humans.

1.9 million years ago - First Homo erectus.

2.5 million years ago - First Homo habilis. Beginning of a period of repeated glaciation (loosely speaking, "ice ages").

3 million years - Cooling trend causes year-round ice to form at the North Pole.

3.9 million years ago - First known Australopithecus afarensis.

5 million years ago - Humans split off from other apes (gorillas and chimpanzees).

21 million years ago - Apes split off from other monkeys.

24 million years ago - Cooling trend causes the formation of grasslands; Antarctica becomes covered with ice.

34 million years ago - Gondwanaland finishes breaking up, with Australia and South America separating from Antarctica.

50 million years ago - India begins to collide with Asia, eventually forming the Himalayas.

67 million years ago - Asteroid hit Mexico, causing the Cretaceous-Tertiary extinction. End of dinosaurs. 50% of all species died out! Intensification of world cooling trend.

114 million years ago - First modern mammals. World begins to cool.

150 million years ago - First birds.

200 million years ago - Pangaea began to split into separate continents: Gondwana to the south and Laurasia to the north, separated by the Tethys Sea.




205 million years ago - The Triassic-Jurassic extinction. End of large amphibians and many reptiles.

235 million years ago - First dinosaurs, flowers.

250 million years ago - The Permian-Triassic extinction. 90% of all species died out! Formation of the supercontinent Pangaea, with surrounding ocean Panthalassa.



313 million years ago - First reptiles.

365 million years ago - The Late Devonian extinction. 70% of marine species died out! First amphibians, trees.

395 million years ago - First insects on land.

415 million years ago - The Old Red Sandstone Continent, also known as Laurussia, is formed by the collision of Baltica and Laurentia at the beginning of the Devonian.

440 million years ago - The Ordovician-Silurian extinction. Most marine species died out.

670 million years ago - First animals.

630-850 million years ago - The Cryogenian Period, also known as Snowball Earth - the worst ice age in the Earth's history.

800 million years ago - The supercontinent Rodinia begins to break up.

1 billion years ago - Formation of the supercontinent Rodinia

1.3 billion years ago - First plants.

1.6 billion years ago - First blue-green algae.

2.4 billion years ago - The Great Oxidation Event: the Earth's atmosphere gets oxygen.

3 billion years ago - Formation of the first known continent, Ur.

3.8 - 4 billion years ago - The Late Heavy Bombardment: a period during which the Earth, Moon, Venus and Mars were subjected to many asteroid impacts, after a relatively calm period of several million years.

4 billion years ago - First life on Earth.

4.45 billion years ago - Formation of Earth complete; storm of asteroid impacts.

4.5 billion years ago - Formation of the Moon: according to the Giant Impact Hypothesis, this happened when Theia collided with proto-Earth.

4.55 billion years ago - Formation of the Solar System.

13.3 billion years ago - Reionization: the first stars heat and ionize hydrogen gas.

13.3 - 13.7 billion years ago - The Dark Ages, after the formation of hydrogen and before the first stars.

13.7 billion years ago - The Big Bang: beginning of the universe as we know it!

http://www.ancientscripts.com/protosinaitic.html

Type Consonantal Alphabetic
Genealogy Proto-Sinaitic
Location West Asia
Time 1900 BCE to 1100 BCE
Direction Variable






FYI: Genesis 10 is known as The Table of Nations, the Nations evolved millions of years after the landmasses divided. thumbs up

http://faculty.gordon.edu/hu/bi/Ted_Hildebrandt/OTeSources/01-Genesis/Text/Articles-Books/Ross-TableNations-BSac.pdf

Studies in the Book of Genesis
Part 3:
The Table of Nations in
Genesis 10--Its Content
Allen P. Ross
The previous article in this series dealt with the structure of
the Table of Nations in Genesis 10.1 The deliberate design in its
construction, symmetry, and unity were examined in an effort to
understand its purpose as a tOdl;OT. But in addition to the evi-
deuce from its structure, there is a wealth of information about
the nations of the world that is important for the complete under-
standing of this chapter within the message of Genesis.
The Analysis of the Passage
The heading of the chapter (Gen. 10:1) declares that this is
the record of the particulars of what became of Shem, Ham, and
Japheth after the Flood. The verse serves not only as a heading for
the Table, but also as a literary connection back to Genesis 9:18
and 28. It is to be read with the oracle of Noah in mind!
THE SONS OF JAPHETH (10:2-5)
In the listing of Noah's sons, Japheth usually comes last. But
here he is first because the tribes descended from Japheth were
spread across the remote lands of the north and therefore were
less involved in Israel's history.
The connection of Japheth and ]Iapeto<j of the Greek tradi-
tion is striking.2 In both Greek and Hebrew traditions, then,
]Iapeto<j was the ancestor of the Greeks. Genesis, however, shows
him to be fully human.3 He is simply the ancestor of many north-
22
The Table of Nations in Genesis 10 - Its Content 23
ern tribes who were non-Semitic in physiognomy, language, and
custom.4
The sons of Japheth are seven. Gomer, mentioned also in
Ezekiel 38:6, represents the Cimmerians, thought to be of the
same stock as the Scythians.5 Magog is also mentioned in Ezekiel
(38:2 and 39:6) as the land of Gog, the region between Armenia
and Cappadocia; the name seems to represent the Scythian
hordes southeast of the Black Sea.6 Madia (ydamA) is the normal
Hebrew word for the Medes (Isa. 13:17) or Media (2 Kings 17:6),
east of Assyria and southwest of the Caspian Sea. Even though
the Median Empire was not formed until the seventh century,
this does not mean that such a people were not known earlier as a
group in the Lake Van area. The text of Shalmaneser III refers to
them in a way that implies they were older inhabitants.
Javan is the general word for the Hellenic race, used
throughout the Old Testament for the Ionians who dwelt in
western Asia Minor.7
Tubal and Meshech are always found together in the Bible;
they represent northern military states (Ezek. 27:13; 32:26;
38:2; 39:1; and Isa. 66:19). Tubal is equivalent to Tibareni in
Pontus; and Meshech is located in the Moschian mountains near
Armenia .8 Their range was from eastern Asia Minor to the
Black Sea.
Tiras has been identified in classical writings as the Thra-
cians living in the area of the river Tiras 9 It is now popular to
identify them as the Pelasgian pirates of the Aegean coasts men-
tioned in Merneptah's list of seafaring peoples.10
From these seven, seven more were derived. From Gomer
came Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah. Ashkenaz appears to
represent a northern branch of Indo-Germanic tribes related to
the Scythians.11 Riphath may bear a remote resemblance to the
name of the river Rhebas near the Bosphorous, or the Riphaean
mountains to the west. Josephus suggested these were the
Paphlagonians.12 Togarmah seems to represent the extreme
north in Ezekiel 27:14 and 38:6.13
From Javan came four "sons"--two geographical names
and two tribal names--all of which are kin to the Greeks.
Elishah is to be identified with the place Alashiyah on the island
of Cyprus.14 Tarshish is the name of a distant coast reached only
by sea (Isa. 66:19; Jer. 10:9; Ezek. 27:12). It has been identified
with several places on the southern coasts of Asia Minor, places
founded by Phoenician shippers.15 Kittim is preserved in the
24 Bibliotheca Sacra - January-March 1981
name of Kition (or Kettion), also on the island of Cyprus;16 this
plural noun refers to the people who inhabited that island, as well
as other islands east of Rhodes.
Dodanim, the last of the four from Javan, is difficult to
identify because of a textual problem. The word, spelled "Roda-
nim" in 1 Chronicles 1:7, would represent the inhabitants of
Rhodes. But the Qere at that passage suggests the spelling
"Dodanim." Moreover, Ezekiel lists a Dedan among northern
merchants (27:15). Neiman suggests they are the Dodanoi, the
people of Dodona, the most ancient oracle in Greece.17
These descendants of Japheth may be broadly summarized
as Cimmerians, Scythians, Medes, Hellenes, and Thracians.
From the fourteen names given, the text adds that from
these the isles of the nations were divided in lands, by tongues,
after families, in nations. They dwell in remote lands and
distant isles.

It should be noted in passing that these names occur fre-
quently in prophetic writings. In Genesis the great military
hordes and western merchants are rather remote. They do not
come into play, so far as the destiny of Israel in the land is
concerned, until much later. Genesis knows something about
them, but they are far beyond the movements of the patriarchs.
They too will eventually subjugate the inhabitants of the land.
THE SONS OF HAM (10:6-20)
More attention is given to the line of Ham than to that of
Japheth or Shem. Ham's line has four branches: Cush, Mizraim,
Put, and Canaan. All four are probably place names for Nubia-
Egypt, Upper and Lower Egypt, Libya, and Phoenicia-Palestine
respectively. In addition, the descendants of these four are both
places and tribes.
Ham is the ancestor of all these people from Phoenicia to
Africa.

The etymology of the word Ham is disputed,18 but it is
used to depict countries in close proximity to Egypt.

Cush is the "eldest son" according to the plan of the Table. In
antiquity this was an independent kingdom on the southern
flank of Egypt; and especially during the reign of Kamose it
served as the backbone of the Egyptian army, helping to expel the
Asiatics (Hyksos).19 So the list begins in the far south with the
African tribes known to the Greeks as Ethiopians.

Mizraim lies to the north of Cush. The word occurs almost
ninety times in the Old Testament for Egypt.
wave wacky boobies

Put is used six times in the Bible, usually representing a
warlike people used as mercenaries in the Egyptian armies (e.g.,
Ezek. 27:10).
Some connect Put with Somaliland, known as Punt
(pwn.t).20 But the identification of Put with Punt is phonetically
problematic.21 Thus the identification with Libya seems to have
more support although not by similarity of names.22

The last of the four is Canaan, which normally represents the
land of Palestine and Phoenicia with its kaleidoscopic mixture of
races, a natural result for a country which is the "bridge" of
continents.23

The name Canaan has been connected with
various etymologies including the Hurrian kinahhu, a reddish-
purple shellfish dye.24 References from antiquity show the name
is geographical. Possibly it may have been used of the merchant
class in early commercial activities.26 Exclusive to the Old
Testament is the use of the term for inhabitants of the area in a
general sense. It later came to mean the pre-Israelite population
without distinction of race or social status. These many tribes
are in some way related to Canaan, and thus are called
Canaanites.
The lines of three of these are now carried further in the
expanding list. First are listed five sons of Cush, all of whom
show expansion in Arabia.27 Seba is usually identified with
Upper Egypt on the Nile, with the ancient city of Meroe between
Berber and Khartoum. Havilah, which means "sand-land," could
fit several areas according to its usage: Ishmaelite Arab territory
(Gen. 25:18), eastern Arabia on the Persian Gulf (Gen. 10:29), the
Ethiopian coast (Gen. 10:7), or even India as an extension of the
east (Gen. 2:11). The fact that Havilah is mentioned under both
Shem and Ham shows mixing of the races: both Shemites and
Hamites lived there.

Sabtah is near the western shore of the Persian Gulf. It has
to been identified as Shabwat, ancient Hadhramaut28 Raamah
appears to have been in southwest Arabia; Sabteca is possibly to
be identified with Samudake, east toward the Persian Gulf.
So these five tribal regions in the lower sections of Arabia
were populated with descendants from Ham. Of them, Raamah
produced two other tribes: Sheba and Dedan. Sheba is the name
of the ancient kingdom in southwest Arabia whose metropolis is
Marib, forty-five miles east of Sena'a of Yemen .29 Dedan is associ-
with modern 'Ula in northern Arabia, an important trading
center from antiquity, bordering on Edom (Ezek. 25:13; 27:20).
Some of the people of Sheba and Dedan traced their ancestry
26 Bibliotheca Sacra - January-March 1981
back through the Cushite Raamah; others traced their ancestry
to Joktan in the line of Shem (10:29).
Inserted in the Table is the story of Nimrod (Gen. 10:8-12).
This is the first dlayA ("begot") section and forms a major stylistic
break from the tribal and territory names preceding it. The verse
need not be interpreted to say that Nimrod was the actual son of
Cush, but that is possible. Many attempts have been made to
identify him, but the most plausible is the reflection of the name
in Ninurta, the god of hunting and war.30
Because his name has been connected with the root dramA ("to
rebel"), and because of the statements made about him, he seems
to represent tyrannical power. Genesis 10:9 describes him as a
mightly hunter,31 a term often used for the hunting of men, and
the founder of the colossal powers of the east, which suggests he
is not just someone known for his derring-do.
Genesis 10:10 lists these cities as the "beginning" of his
kingdom: Babel, Erech, and Accad (and Calneh in the land of
Shinar). Since Babel, the well-known city of Babylon, is listed
first, it is not surprising to see it as the subject of the next
narrative (11:1-9), where it is described as the first gathering
point of the race.
Erech is the Akkadian Uruk, to be identified with ancient
Warka, the city of heroes like Gilgamesh 32 It is one hundred
miles southeast of Babylon. Accad is another ancient city, the
Agade of Sargon, north of Babylon on the Euphrates. It declined
sharply in importance about 2000 B.C.
Calneh is nowhere attested in cuneiform. While some have
tried to find a city so named in the great Shinar region, many
have followed Albright and translated it "and all of them.”33
The second part of the Nimrod digression lists the cities he
colonized (Gen. 10:11-12). Nimrod went out to Assyria34 and
built Nineveh, Rehoboth-Ir, Calah, and Resen. Nineveh is the
most famous city of Assyria (just as Babel was for the other
region). Rehoboth-Ir could be explaining Nineveh, but probably
is the suburb of Rebit Nina. Calah is Kalhu, modern Nimrud
situated twenty miles south. Resen may be Risnu, between the
other cities. It seems that all these cities were close enough
together to be one great metropolis.
Nimrod's exploits extended over two geographical areas,
Shinar and Assyria, and included seven cities. All these are part
of the Hamitic line.35
The Table of Nations in Genesis 10 - Its Content 27
After this dlayA section, another follows: Mizraim developed
into tribes. From the Egyptians sprang the Ludim, a group of
African tribes west of the Delta;36 the Anamim, in the vicinity of
Cyrene;37 the Lehabim, the Libyans on the north African shore
(Nah. 3:9 and Dan. 11:43); the Naphtuhim, the people of the
Delta (Lower Egypt); the Pathrusim, the people of Upper Egypt;38
the Casluhim, the people who dwelt east of the Delta between
Egypt and Canaan;39 and the Caphtorim, the Cretans.40
The clause "from whence come the Philistines" is problem-
atic because of its position in the text. Scripture connects the
origin of the Philistines with Caphtor (Amos 9:7; Deut. 2:23;
Jer. 47:4), but the Caphtorim, the Cretans, come after this
clause. While some have suggested rearranging the clauses, it
may not be necessary. The clause in the Table suggests migration
and not lineage. Amos has the Philistines from Caphtor in the
same sense that Israel was from Egypt--migration and not
origination.41 The difficulty may be solved by looking at their
origin and their migration from the Aegean bases through Caph-
tor into the Delta and finally into Palestine.
But part of the problem is the general assumption that this
name is anachronistic since all sources so far attest that the
Philistines in the strict sense date from around 1200 B.C. But the
Philistines of Genesis are quite different from those of later
periods. Grintz concluded that they were different enough to
posit successive migrations of different tribes .42 He concluded
there were three migrations: the first was the migration of
Pelasgo-Philistine tribes from Casluhim (Genesis and Exodus),
the second was the movement of the Philistines from Caphtor to
Gaza, and the third was the further movement of the Pelasgo-
Philistines in the period of Rameses III. Therefore the tribes from
Mizraim are seven, and out of one come the Philistines. If this be
so, then the powerful Egyptian influence carried far north into
the Aegean.
The final Hamite line to be traced is that of the sons of
Canaan (Gen. 10:15-19). This line focuses on the peoples living
in the land promised to Israel. In fact, the section closes with
the territorial boundaries specifically given.
Once again a dlayA section is inserted to introduce the cities and
tribes. The first-begotten is Sidon, the predominant Phoenician
city.44 This suggests that the founder gave his name to the city.
Heth, the Hittites in the Old Testament, is problematic here
under Canaan. The text is listing a mixed population in Canaan,
28 Bibliotheca Sacra - January-March 1981
and so the term is justified if it describes Hittites who swept
south in vast ethnic movements.45
A series of tribes are mentioned beginning with the Jebu-
sites. The Jebusites dwelt in Jebus (Jerusalem) and were part of
the early stock of Canaanite tribes. The Amorites pose another
problem. The term can refer to a mixed population in the land in
general. It does not fit the description of the western Semites
whose center was in Mari.46 These are smaller ethnic groups that
inhabited the mountains around Jordan.
Very little is known about the Girgashites and the Hivites.
They are mentioned only in the cliche lists for Canaanites in
Edom, Shechem, and Gibeon.47 Possibly terms like "Hivite" and
"Hittite" are used pejoratively and ideologically, but as North
says, "we cannot see that all organic link of origin with those
foreign populaces is excluded."48
The rest of the list includes the Arkites, those living in Leba-
non north of Sidon; the Sinites near 'Arqa; the Arvadites, the
most northerly of Phoenician cities north of the river El Kebir; the
Zemarites, those living in the town of Sumra (modern) north of
‘Arqa; and the Hamathites, the inhabitants of Hamath on the
Orontes. Hamath, it may be noted, is the central point of the
northern boundary of the land.
It is clear that the writer wished to emphasize the names of
the Canaanites who dwelt in the land promised to Israel because
he mentions the familiar boundary notices in all directions, from
the cities of the plain to Gerar to the northern extremities. Such
an emphasis coming after the account of the curse of Canaan and
written for a people who were to dispossess these Canaanites
would have great impact.
THE SONS OF SHEM (10:21-31)
A new heading lists the relationship of Shem to Japheth (the
brother) and Eber (the descendant)--the former speaking of an
alliance based on Genesis 9 and the latter speaking of the connec-
tion in the line to the Hebrews.
The first name in the list is Elam. Descendants of Shem early
penetrated the highlands east of Babylon even though they were
later not the dominant racial or linguistic group.49 Asshur,
Shem's second son, is the name for the region and people of
Assyria. Arpachshad, the third name, is the ancestor of the
Hebrews. Arpachshad's meaning and location have caused con-
siderable speculation, but he can only be generally listed as resid-
The Table of Nations in Genesis 10 - Its Content 29
ing northeast of Nineveh.50 Lud is probably the Ludbu of the
Assyrians, situated on the Tigris. Aram is the name of the Ara-
mean tribes of antiquity living in the steppes of Mesopotamia.
The descendants from Aram--Uz, Hul, Gether, and Mash -
are not well known. They seem to be located in the north between
Armenia and Mesopotamia.51
The passage then refers to the developing line from Arpach-
shad, using the dlayA form through Shelah to Eber. One of Eber's
sons is Peleg, in whose days the earth was divided (probably
referring to the division of nations at Babel 52). Once the Table
mentions Peleg, it traces his line no further. Rather, it lists the
many tribes from Joktan, using the dlayA formula again.
The first tribe was Almodad, referring to a South Arabian
people. The second is Sheleph, another tribe of the southern
Arabian peninsula.54 Hazarmaveth, the third, is identified with
the exporter of myrrh known as Hadramaut in Southern
Arabia. Jerah and Hadoram are difficult, but are assumed to be
in the same vicinity. Uzal is the designation of San'a, the old
capital of Yemen. Diklah, the Arabic name for "date-palm," may
refer to an oasis. Obal seems to be 'Abil, a term used for several
localities in Yemen. Abimael is taken to be a genuine Sabaean
formation, with the ma being emphatic ("my father, verily, he
is God").
Sheba was also listed under Ham; the name here attests to
the fact that Joktanites lived there as well.56 Ophir and Havilah,
also listed under Ham, were southern Arabian territories rich in
gold. Jobab is assumed to be identical to Yuhaybib in South
Arabia.
These thirteen descendants of Joktan represent settled Ara-
bian tribes in the peninsula. Israel would find ancient blood ties
with the Joktanites of the desert of Arabia, as well as her relatives
to the east.
The final verse of the chapter forms the colophon-type end-
ing of the Table. All families came from the sons of Noah, but
these families listed here have significant developments (dlayA) as
far as Israel's interests are concerned.
The Meaning of the Passage
Most commentators observe that the Table demonstrates the
unity of the human race. Coming from the sons of Noah, the
survivors of the Flood were fruitful and multiplied.
30 Bibliotheca Sacra - January-March 1981
But the passage is far more complex than that. The Table is a
select list of names, and that selection must serve a purpose. The
names are names of individuals, cities, tribes, and nations
arranged according to the genealogical connections of the ances-
tors or founders. The pattern of the Table is segmented rather
than linear; it is designed to show blood ties, treaties, alliances
and other connections between existing peoples.
That the promised land is central to the Table can be seen
from the arrangement of the descendants. The Japhethites are
spread from east to west across the northern frontier; the Ham-
ites surround the land from south to west; and the Shemites are
traced from the eastern to the southern borders of the land.
Moreover, the preoccupation with the Canaanites in the land of
promise shows the concern of the writer to fit the Table to the
message of the book: the fulfillment of God's promise to bless
Israel as a nation in that land, and to bless those nations that
bless her, and curse those who are antagonistic to her.
The Table then deliberately selected these tribes and traced
their development. This was done by expanding (in the dlayA ["be-
got"] sections) important elements found in the basic genealogy
(the yneB; ["sons of"] structure). From the heading (tOdlOT, "particu-
lars") it is clear that the passage was designed to do just this. The
purpose of this tOdl;OT in Genesis is to trace what became of
Noah's descendants, but the particular items included in this
genealogy were selected because of their significance for Israel.
The tOdl;OT of the yneB; Noah moves in four directions (in each of
the dlayA sections). Through these four sections the genealogy
focuses on the dominant kingdoms of Assyria and Shinar, the
powerful Egyptian tribes, the Canaanite tribes in their lands, and
the Arabian tribes of the line of Shem. These are peoples with
whom the new nation of Israel would have dealings in accord with
the oracle of Noah in Genesis 9.
According to Genesis, the new nation of Israel was to be
blessed as God's people in the land of Canaan. God's plan to bless
Israel involved the movement, displacement, and subjugation of
other peoples. The oracle of Noah in Genesis 9 anticipated the
blessing for Shem, along with Japheth, and the cursing of Ca-
naan, a son of Ham. This Table in Genesis 10 gives direction to
that oracle. It presents the lines of Shem and Japheth as pure
tribal groups around the promised land; it also presents the old
block of Hamites, especially the mixed races in the land of Ca-
naan, as the predominant powers on the earth. The dlayA sections
The Table of Nations in Genesis 10--Its Content 31
identify these tribes for Israel and signify their relationship to the
blessing or cursing.
Notes
1 Allen P. Ross, "The Table of Nations in Genesis 10-Its Structure," Bibliotheca
Sacra 137 (October-December 1980):340-53.
2 Apollodorus The Library 1. 2-3, Loeb Classical Library (Cambridge: Harvard
University Press, 1921), p. 12; Hesiod Works and Days, lines 50, 54, and
Theogany, lines 507-12, 543, Loeb Classical Library (Cambridge: Harvard Uni-
versity Press, 1914), pp. 6, 116, 118.
3 David Neiman, "The Two Genealogies of Japheth," Alter Orient and Altes
Testament 22 (1973):124.
4 E. Dhorme, "Les Peuples issus de Japhet d'apres le chapitre X de la Genese,"
Syria 13 (1932):28-49; Donald J. Wiseman, "Genesis 10: Some Archaeological
Considerations," 925th Ordinary General Meeting of the Victoria Institute,
December 6, 1954, p. 17.
5 They are listed in Assyrian as Gimirraya, and in Greek as Kimmerioi (Odys-
sey 11. 14 and Herodotus 1. 15, 103; 4. 1-142). Speiser identifies them with
Cymry as in the Welsh (E. A. Speiser, Genesis, The Anchor Bible [Garden City, NY:
Doubleday & Co., 1964], p. 63).
6 Josephus Antiquities of the Jews 1. 122-29. Skinner identified them with
barbarians called Ga-ga (John Skinner, A Critical and Exegetical Commentary
on Genesis [Edinburgh: T. & T. Clark, 19101, p. 197); Speiser related the name
to Gyges of Lydia and Gogaia in the Amarna Letters (Speiser, Genesis, p. 66).
7 They are called Yamanai in Sargon's texts, Ym'n in the fourteenth century Ras
Shamra tablets, and Ye-uan-(n)a in Egyptian referring to the Sea Peoples.
For a discussion of the identification of Javan with the twelve settlements iii
western Asia Minor, see Cassuto, From Noah to Abraham (Jerusalem: Magnes
Press, 1953), p. 190.
8 Wiseman says they are the same as the Hittite Tipal and Tibar district which
Naram Sin traversed around 2200 B.C. (Wiseman, "Genesis 10: Some Archaeolog-
ical Considerations," p. 18). Herodotus located the region in the north on the shore
of the Black Sea (Herodotus 3. 94); Josephus called them Cappadocians (Antiqui-
ties of the Jews 1. 122-29).
9 Thucydides 4. 109; Herodotus 1. 57, 59.
10 The connection with the Etruscans, suggested by Dhorme, is supported by
Wiseman. It would be comparable to the classical Tursanioi.
11 See Francis Brown, S. R. Driver, and Charles A. Briggs, A Hebrew and
English Lexicon of the Old Testament (Oxford: At the Clarendon Press, 1907), p.
79. They identify the word as Ascan(ians) with the az ending of Armenian
patronymics. The texts of Esarhaddon list Asguzai in the Lake Urmia region.
12 A textual problem makes the identification difficult; 1 Chronicles 1:6 has a'1
for the r. Since so little is known of the name, it is impossible to argue the case.
13 Hittite writings of Marsilis II (fourteenth century B. C.) list a district known as
Tagarma north of the road from Haran to Carchemish (Cassuto, From Noah to
Abraham, p. 192).
14 The name is listed on Amarna and Hittite lists. Excavations show these
people supplied purple to Tyre before being displaced by the Philistines around
1200 B.C. (Y. Lynn Holmes, "The Location of Alashiya," Journal of the American
Oriental Society 91 [19711:426-29).
15 The meaning of Tarshish is "foundry," according to David Neiman: the ships
of Tarshish carried iron ore ("Phoenician Place-Names," Journal of Near Eastern
Studies 24 (1965):113-15), Albright suggested Sardinia ("New Light on the Early
32 Bibliotheca Sacra - January-March 1981
History of Phoenician Colonization" Bulletin of the American Schools of
Oriental Research 83 [19411:14-22). Herodotus had identified it with Spain's
Tartassos (Herodotus 1. 163; 4. 152; see also Strabo 3. 151).
16 It is still a designation of the Greeks in later literature (1 Mace. 1:1; 8:5;
Babylonian Talmud Ta'anith 5b).
17 Neiman, "The Two Genealogies of Japheth," p. 121 (cf. Iliad 2. 750; 16.233-34
Odyssey 14. 327; 19. 296; Apollodorus The Library 1. 9, 16).
18 Neiman thinks it is related to the Egyptian term for "Black Land," for that title
of their land in Bohairic is Khemi; but the Hieroglyphic Egyptian begins with K
(Neiman, "The Two Genealogies of Japheth," p. 122).
19 T. Save-Soderbergh, "The Nubian Kingdom of the Second Intermediate
Period," Kush 4 (1956):54-61.
20 Kenneth A. Kitchen, "Punt and How to Get There," Orientalia, n.s. 4
(1971):184-207; Wendell Phillips, Qataban and Sheba (New York: Harcourt
Brace, & Co., 1955), p. 108.
21 The connection between the two is phonetically problematic, not only be
cause of the "n" in Punt, but also because of the "t" as against the "t" of Punt
which is only a feminine termination (J. Simons, "The 'Table of Nations' [Gen. 10]
Its General Structure and Meaning," Oudtestamentische Studien 10 [ 1954]:179)
22 The Greek and Latin versions refer to it as Libya. Josephus says Libya was
founded by Phoutes (Antiquities of the Jews 1. 132). Jubilees 9:1 takes it as Libya,
and Libyan mercenaries are well known from extra-biblical literature (but
Puntians are not) (Simons, "The 'Table of Nations,"' p. 180).
23 John C. L. Gibson, "Observations on Some Important Ethnic Terms in th
Pentateuch," Journal of Near Eastern Studies 20 (1961):217.
24 B. Maisler, "Canaan and the Canaanites," Bulletin of theAmerican Schools o
Oriental Research 102 (1946):7-12; E. A. Speiser, "The Name Phoinikes,"
Language 12 (1936):121-26.
25 Robert North, "The Hivites," Biblica 54 (1973):51.
26 The Memphis Stele of Amenophis II mentions 640 Canaanites in a social
standing (not ethnic); and the Tell El Amarna letters (EA 9, 19) mention ki-na-ha-
a-a-u. See Gibson, "Observations on Some Important Ethnic Terms," p. 217. .
27 James A. Montgomery, Arabia and the Bible (New York: KTAV Publishing
House, 1969).
28 Ibid., p. 42.
29 Cassuto, among others, believed that it had first been northern on the
peninsula, and then moved south around the eighth century B.C. (Cassuto, From
Noah to Abraham, p. 199).
30 Wiseman, "Genesis 10: Some Archaeological Considerations," p. 17; Bohl
"Babel and Bibel, " p. 115. Speiser takes him to be Tukulti-Ninurta I, an early ruler
of Assyria ("In Search of Nimrod," Oriental and Biblical Studies [Philadelphia
University of Pennsylvania Press, 1967], pp. 41-52).
31 The Septuagint renders dyica rOBGi as "the hunting giant," the Arabic as "the
terrible tyrant," and the Syriac as " the warlike giant." Midrash Rabbah 37:2 says
he snared people (see also Yoma 10a, and Josephus Antiquities of the Jews 1. 113-14).
32 Wiseman suggests that since Erech is written Uruk or Unuk in Sumerian, it
might be the city named after Enoch. Enoch's son was Irad, and he may have
founded Eridu (Wiseman, "Genesis 10: Some Archaeological Considerations," p 20).
33 J. A. Thompson, "Samaritan Evidence for 'All of them in the land of Shinar
(Gen. 10:10)," Journal of Biblical Literature 90 (1971):99-102.
34 It is possible to translate it "Asshur went out," but it is probably better to take
it the other way since the story is about Nimrod's exploits, and the preceding was
only the beginning.
35 Wiseman points out that archaeology shows that the earliest inhabitant
The Table of Nations in Genesis 10 - Its Content 33
and languages of the region were not Semitic. Before 2600 the civilization is
"Sumerian." Moreover there is a direct cultural link between Assyria, Babylonia,
and Egypt (Wiseman, "Genesis 10: Some Archaeological Considerations," p. 21).
36 Cassuto, From Noah to Abraham, p. 200. Los connects them to Lydian (Asia
Minor) mercenaries (F. J. Los, "The Table of Peoples of the Tenth Chapter of
Genesis," The Mankind Quarterly 7 [ 1967]:148).
37 Los connects them with On, the inhabitants of Heliopolis being meant
(ibid., p. 148). See also W. F. Albright, "A Colony of Cretan Mercenaries on the
Coast of the Negeb," Journal of the Palestine Oriental Society 1, 2 (1920-
22):117-94.
38 See Brown, Driver, and Briggs, who define it as "southland" and connect it
with the Akkadian Paturisi and the Egyptian P-to-rest (A Hebrew and English
Lexicon, p. 837). See also "Pathros"' in Isaiah 11:11 and Jeremiah 44:1.
39 Leupold thinks they may have come from Crete, earlier than the Philistines,
as part of the swarms of nations mixing with Egyptians (H. C. Leupold, Exposition
of Genesis [Grand Rapids: Baker Book House, 1953], p. 370).
40 They are identified with Keftiu ("the region beyond"), referring to the
Mediterranean in the Egyptian language (Skinner, Genesis, p. 214).
41 Kenneth A. Kitchen, "The Philistines," in Peoples of Old Testament Times,
ed. Donald J. Wiseman (Oxford: At. the Clarendon Press, 1973), pp. 53-54.
42 J. M. Grintz, "The Immigration of the First Philistines in the Inscriptions"
[Hebrew], Tarbiz 17 (1945):32-42; "Notes on the Immigration of the First Philis-
tines in the Inscriptions" [Hebrew], Tarbiz 19 (1947):64.
43 A. Van Selms, "The Canaanites in the Book of Genesis," Oudtestamentische
Studien 12 (1958):182-213.
44 Wiseman points out that the Table must go back before the thirteenth
century due to the omission of Tyre (Wiseman, "Genesis 10: Some Archaeological
Considerations," p. 21).
45 See Hans Giiterback, "Toward a Definition of the Term Hittite," Oriens 10
(1975):233-39; Harry A. Hoffner, "Some Contributions of Hittitology to Old
Testament Study," Tyndale Bulletin 20 (1969):37; and Gibson, "Observations on
Some Important Ethnic Terms in the Pentateuch," p. 225. Of course if Genesis 10
is talking about the very beginnings, then there is no need to look for migrations.
But the Hattians or Nesites, the people of Hatti, remain a problem.
46 Alfred Halder, Who Were the Amorites? (Leiden: E. J. Brill, 1971), pp. 20, 65-
66; Giorgio Buccellati, The Amorites of the Ur III Period (Naples: Institutio
Orientals di Napoli, 1966); M. Liverani, "The Amorites," in Peoples of Old Testa-
ment Times, p. 102.
47 North said the Hivites must represent the Horites or Hurrian element ("The
Hivites," p. 44).
48 Ibid., p. 61.
49 Arno Poebel, "The Name of Elam in Sumerian, Akkadian, and He-
brew," American Journal of Semitic Languages and Literatures 48 (1931):20-
37:2 says 26• See also Wiseman, "Genesis 10: Some Archaeological Considerations,
p. 22.
50 Several have tried to connect Arpachshad with the Kasdim, or Chaldeans
(e-g•, Los, The Table of Peoples of the Tenth Chapter of Genesis,” p. 158).
51 B. Maisler, The Genealogy of the Sons of Nahor and the Historical Back-
ground of the Book of Job" [Hebrew], Zion 11 (1946):1-16.
52 See the author's article, "The Dispersion of the Nations in Genesis 11:1-9, in
the forthcoming April-June 1981 issue of Bibliotheca Sacra.
53 Most take this to be a combination of the article lxa plus ddAOm ("friend”).
54 Silph is a district of Yemen, and Salph a Yemenite tribe (G. R. Driver, "Notes
34 Bibliotheca Sacra - January-March 1981
in Some Recently Recovered Proper Names, Bulletin of the American Schools of
Oriental Research 90 [1943]:34).
55 Phillips notes that even today tribesmen of Hadramaut proudly state they are
descendants of Joktan, supposed by them to be Qahtan, great-great-great-
grandson of Shem, son of Noah, and legendary ancestor of all South Arabians
(Phillips, Qataban and Sheba, pp. 28-29).
56 Gus W. Van Beck, "Prolegomenon," in Montgomery, Arabia and the Bible, pp
xiii-xv. He suggests that there were commercial and ethnic affinities
thumbs up


Provide one Rabbi/Biblical Sholar that supports your Bullshit........you can't. The above exegesis proves you are completely full of shit......bat shit.....that is why you are Suzy Woo Woo wave
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MoMo

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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  MoMo on Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:02 pm

true lilly wrote: rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin Seriously,[/color] those who still want to believe, those
who trash me, rather than my many Public,
AND PRIVATE WARNINGS, should forget about me,
and why I know these (and the many things I DON'T
so much as say to myself, let alone post on), are all,
connected, and just get on with Getting Right With
God.

Yo!!!! Suzy Woo Woo, clue me up how lying about Gods Book is 'getting right' with Him, or for that matter, gossiping and judging and cursing others is 'getting right' with Him?

You, propose, without any credentials or prerequisite education in Hebrew, that you are able to interpret the Jews Sacred Hebrew scriptures better, more accurately; then ALL the Rabbis/Teachers and credentialed Biblical Scholars on Planet Earth and make the preposterous, unsupported claim that the Hebrew word Mizraim does not mean Egypt, or that the Hebrews did not sojourn from Egypt, through the Sinai into Canaan/Israel.

You're Hubris is so gargantuan you use a Language you do not know: Hebrew, and attempt to write the Jews and Israel out of their own Book.......your Hubris is of monumental size. You claim the Torah is 'done away' with and then proceed to reinterpret it.

Explain that. thumbs up


I proved you were wrong about your False Doctrine of Church replacement of the Jews and Israel Theology.

http://www.shema.com/Combating%20Replacement%20Theology/crt-004.php

I proved you wrong about your False Theology that Yahshua/Jesus and the Apostles 'did away' with YHWHs Torah/Instruction.

http://www.yrm.org/yah_p_law.htm

Romans 10:4—
For Yahshua is the ultimate result of keeping the Law unto righteousness for everyone who believes.


"I am the LORD your God who brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of slavery. You shall have no other gods in My presence..."
This commandment is to be aware that the God of Israel exists absolutely and influences all events in the world[23][dead link] and that the goal of the redemption from Egypt was to become His servants (Rashi). It requires the acknowledgment of the single God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and the denial of the existence of false gods (Rashi)



Yahshua said (Matthew 23:37-40) “Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang (hinge) all the law and the prophets.”

The whole point of Human existence is to learn and practice the SEcond Commandment that Yahshua declares...........Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. ........so far you are failing miserably............. thumbs up ...........gossiping, judging, fearmongering, bearing false witness...........time to shape up and fly right Suzy Woo Woo............... thumbs up

Time to stand Toe to Toe like you falsely claim you do......support your False Teachings.................you extract Scripture from it context to twist it to fit your bias, Noah was 10 Generations AFTER Adam, long after the continents divided, Peleg was 5 Generations after Noah, the verse you twist to claim it is about the Continents Dividing means no such thing...it is in relation to the Tower of Babylon incident when YHWH confused the tongues of Humankind and dispersed them to the far corners of the Earth.........the whole icident is about the Hubris of humans, something you should, but don't recognize....read/study the following Documents.
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Studies in the Book of Genesis Part 1:
The Curse of Canaan
Allen P. Ross


http://faculty.gordon.edu/hu/bi/Ted_Hildebrandt/OTeSources/01-Genesis/Text/Articles-Books/Ross_CurseOfCanaan_BSac.pdf


Genesis, the book of beginnings, is primarily concerned with
tracing the development of God's program of blessing. The bless-
ing is pronounced on God's creation, but sin (with its subsequent
curse) brought deterioration and decay. After the Flood there is a
new beginning with a renewal of the decrees of blessing, but once
again corruption and rebellion leave the human race alienated
and scattered across the face of the earth. Against this backdrop
God began His program of blessing again, promising blessing to
those obedient in faith and cursing to those who rebel. The rest of
the book explains how this blessing developed: God's chosen
people would become a great nation and inherit the land of Ca-
aan. So throughout Genesis the motifs of blessing and cursing
occur again and again in connection with those who are chosen
and those who are not......................The purpose of this section in Genesis, then, is to portray the
characteristics of the three branches of the human race in rela-
tion to blessing and cursing. In pronouncing the oracle, Noah
discerned the traits of his sons and, in a moment of insight,
determined that the attributes of their descendants were em-
bodied in their personalities.2 Because these sons were pri-
mogenitors of the families of the earth, the narrator is more
interested in the greater meaning of the oracle with respect to
tribes and nations in his day than with the children of Shem,
Ham, and Japheth.3
Shem, the ancestor of the Shemites to whom the Hebrews
belonged, acted in good taste and was blessed with the possession
of the knowledge of the true God, Yahweh. Japheth, the ancestor
of the far-flung northern tribes which include the Hellenic
peoples,4 also acted properly and thus shared in the blessing of
Shem and was promised geographical expansion. In contrast,
Ham, represented most clearly to Israel by the Egyptians and
Canaanites, acted wrongly in violating sexual customs regarded
as sacred and as a result had one line of his descendants cursed
with subjugation.5
So the oracle of Noah, far from being concerned simply with
the fortunes of the immediate family, actually pertains to vast
movements of ancient peoples...................Canaan, then, is the prototype of the population that suc-
cumbed to enervating influences and was doomed by its vices to
enslavement at the hands of hardier and more virtuous races.52
Because Ham, the "father" of Canaan, had desecrated the honor
of his father by seeing his uncovered nakedness, this divine and
prophetic oracle is pronounced on the people who would be
known for their immorality in a shameful way, a trait discernible
in this little story in the history of beginnings.
The blessing aspect is given to Shem, but the wording is
unexpected: "Blessed be the LORD [Yahweh], the God of Shem."
The emphasis on the possession of God by his name is
strengthened in this line in a subtle way. Delitzsch says, "Yahweh
makes himself a name in becoming the God of Shem, and thus
entwines His name with that of Shem, which means ‘name.’53
By blessing one's God, the man himself is blessed. The idea is
that Shem will ascribe his good fortune to Yahweh his God, for his
advantage is not personal merit; his portion is Yahweh.54 The
great line of blessing will be continued through Shem from Noah
to Abram, the man of promise.
Here again, however, the point of the oracle looks to the
descendants. It would then be clear to Israel, who found them-
selves in such a personal, covenantal relationship with Yahweh,
that they were the heirs of this blessing..........


4Unfortunately Part 2 I have not found on the 'Net, for free ($50).....here are Parts 3 & 4


Who is this 'god' you serve? It can't be YHWH. You know nothing of Him or His Plan for humankind.

Studies in the Book of Genesis Part 3:

The Table of Nations in

Genesis 10--Its Content

Allen P. Ross



http://faculty.gordon.edu/hu/bi/Ted_Hildebrandt/OTeSources/01-Genesis/Text/Articles-Books/Ross-TableNations-BSac.htm

THE SONS OF HAM (10:6-20)

More attention is given to the line of Ham than to that of

Japheth or Shem. Ham's line has four branches: Cush, Mizraim,

Put, and Canaan. All four are probably place names for Nubia-

Egypt, Upper and Lower Egypt, Libya, and Phoenicia-Palestine

respectively. In addition, the descendants of these four are both

places and tribes.

Ham is the ancestor of all these people from Phoenicia to

Africa. The etymology of the word Ham is disputed,18 but it is

used to depict countries in close proximity to Egypt.

Cush is the "eldest son" according to the plan of the Table. In

antiquity this was an independent kingdom on the southern

flank of Egypt; and especially during the reign of Kamose it

served as the backbone of the Egyptian army, helping to expel the

Asiatics (Hyksos).19 So the list begins in the far south with the

African tribes known to the Greeks as Ethiopians.

Mizraim lies to the north of Cush. The word occurs almost

ninety times in the Old Testament for Egypt...................Mizraim developed

into tribes. From the Egyptians sprang the Ludim, a group of

African tribes west of the Delta;36 the Anamim, in the vicinity of

Cyrene;37 the Lehabim, the Libyans on the north African shore

(Nah. 3:9 and Dan. 11:43); the Naphtuhim, the people of the

Delta (Lower Egypt); the Pathrusim, the people of Upper Egypt;38

the Casluhim, the people who dwelt east of the Delta between

Egypt and Canaan;39 and the Caphtorim, the Cretans.40

The clause "from whence come the Philistines" is problem-

atic because of its position in the text. Scripture connects the

origin of the Philistines with Caphtor (Amos 9:7; Deut. 2:23;

Jer. 47:4), but the Caphtorim, the Cretans, come after this

clause. While some have suggested rearranging the clauses, it

may not be necessary. The clause in the Table suggests migration

and not lineage. Amos has the Philistines from Caphtor in the

same sense that Israel was from Egypt--migration and not

origination.41 The difficulty may be solved by looking at their

origin and their migration from the Aegean bases through Caph-

tor into the Delta and finally into Palestine.

.................................That the promised land is central to the Table can be seen

from the arrangement of the descendants. The Japhethites are

spread from east to west across the northern frontier; the Ham-

ites surround the land from south to west; and the Shemites are

traced from the eastern to the southern borders of the land.

Moreover, the preoccupation with the Canaanites in the land of

promise shows the concern of the writer to fit the Table to the

message of the book: the fulfillment of God's promise to bless

Israel as a nation in that land, and to bless those nations that

bless her, and curse those who are antagonistic to her.

The Table then deliberately selected these tribes and traced

their development.
...............................The passage then refers to the developing line from Arpach-shad, using the form through Shelah to Eber. One of Eber's

sons is Peleg, in whose days the earth was divided (probably

referring to the division of nations at Babel 52). Once the Table

mentions Peleg, it traces his line no further.
.................According to Genesis, the new nation of Israel was to be

blessed as God's people in the land of Canaan. God's plan to bless

Israel involved the movement, displacement, and subjugation of

other peoples. The oracle of Noah in Genesis 9 anticipated the

blessing for Shem, along with Japheth, and the cursing of Ca-

naan, a son of Ham. This Table in Genesis 10 gives direction to

that oracle. It presents the lines of Shem and Japheth as pure

tribal groups around the promised land; it also presents the old

block of Hamites, especially the mixed races in the land of Ca-

naan, as the predominant powers on the earth
........................
wave


Studies in the Book of Genesis
Part 4:
The Dispersion of the
Nations in Genesis 11:1-9
Allen P. Ross
Introduction to the Passage


http://faculty.gordon.edu/hu/bi/ted_hildebrandt/OTeSources/01-Genesis/Text/Articles-Books/Ross-DispersionGn11-BSac.pdf

THE NATURE OF THE ACCOUNT
The narrative in Genesis 11:1-9 describes the divine inter-
vention among the human family to scatter them across the face
of the earth by means of striking at the :heart of their unity- their
language. A quick reading of the passage shows that the pre-
dominant idea is not the tower of Babel but this scattering.
If the point is not simply the tower, then this passage does not
present, as some have suggested, a Hebrew adaptation of the
Greek Titans storming heaven to dislodge God. Rather, the char-
acteristics of the people in this story are anxiety and pride
through their own gregariousness.1 The tower, on the one hand,
is born from the people's fear of being scattered across the earth;
and on the other hand it is an attempt to frustrate God's plan to
fill the earth (Gen. 9:1).
The sin. Since the story has the trappings of a judgment
narrative in which Yahweh interrupts mankind's misguided
activities and scatters them abroad, it may be assumed that the
antithesis of this scattering must be the sin. The major error was
not the building of a city, but the attempt of the race to live in one
City.2 Therefore it appears that the human family was striving for
unity, security, and social immortality (making a name) in de-
fiance of God's desire for them to fill the earth.
Divine punishment. It is important to keep in mind that the
"judgment" was not the destruction of the city but of the language that united the people. It was shattered into a multiplicity
of languages so that the common bond was destroyed.3 Thus the
text is demonstrating that the present number of languages that
form national barriers is a monument to sin.....................So it is with this story that the common history of all man-
kind comes to an abrupt end, which leaves the human race
hopelessly scattered across the face of the entire earth. It is this
that makes the present narrative so different from those preced-
ing it: In each judgment there was a gracious provision for hope
but in this judgment there is none. It does not offer a token of
grace, a promise of any blessing, a hope of salvation, or a way of
escape. There is no clothing for the naked sinner, no protective
mark for the fugitive, no rainbow in the dark sky. There is no ray
of hope. The primeval age ends with judgmental scattering and
complete confusion. The blessing is not here; the world must
await the new history.
In view of this, the story of the scattering of the nations is
actually the turning point of the book from primeval history to
the history of the blessing. From this very confused and dis-
persed situation nations would develop in utter futility until God
would make a great nation through one man who himself would
be "scattered" from this alluvial plain to the land of Canaan. The
blessings of final redemption and unification would come
through his seed.........................Irony is seen in the beginning and the ending of this pas-
sage. The group at Babel began as the whole earth (11:1), but
now they were spread over the whole earth (11:9). By this the
lesson is clarified: God's purpose will be accomplished in spite of
the arrogance and defiance of man's own purposes. He brings
down the proud, but exalts the faithful.
The significance of this little story is great. It explains to
God's people how the nations were scattered abroad. Yet the
import goes much deeper. The fact that it was Babylon, the
beginning of kingdoms under Nimrod from Cush, adds a rather
ominous warning: Great nations cannot defy God and long sur-
vive. The new nation of Israel need only survey the many nations
around her to perceive that God disperses and curses the rebel-
lious, bringing utter confusion and antagonism among them. If
Israel would obey and submit to God's will, then she would be the
source of blessing to the world.
Unfortunately, Israel also raised her head in pride and re-
fused to obey the Lord God. Thus she too was scattered across the
face of the earth.

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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  sharky on Mon Nov 07, 2011 10:49 am

el kabong wrote:Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia thumbs up

Europe is a LARGER Continent then Australia. As a matter of FACT; Australia is the SMALLEST/RUNT Continent. And as large it may be, the size of your EGO makes it uncomfortably confining. But hey, that's only one of your many lies and deceptions. Let's talk about Mizraim, the Hebrew word for Egypt. You say it isn't. Where is your credentialed support for your ignorant nonsense? thumbs up

http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Mizraim.html

Meaning and etymology of the name Mizraim
Mizraim


Mizraim is a son of Ham, son of Noah (Genesis 12:10). This name is also the common name for Egypt (which is also known as 'the land of Ham,', for instance in Psalm 105:23).

Egypt was known by the names Musuru, Musru, Misir or Masri in other languages, and Mizraim is probably simply a phonetic transliteration into Hebrew of any of them. The word looks identical to what a dual form of would look like (see below). This duality possibly helped to denote Upper and Lower Egypt. The word for Egyptian is .

The similar (masor), a poetic nickname for Egypt that is used on three different occasions (Isaiah 19:6, 2 Kings 19:24 = Isaiah 37:25, Micah 7:12), may shed some understanding on how a Hebrew audience might have interpreted the name Mizraim.

The noun (masor) means siege, entrenchment, and it derives from the verb (sur), bind, besiege. Another derivation of this same verb is the noun , stronghold. HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament notes that a stronghold or walled city may be an instrument of protection during the first stages of a war, but will turn into a lethal trap if a siege last long. A beautiful figurative use of this word occurs in Psalm 31:21, where the author compares himself under siege by his troubles.

The verb from which the noun derives, is part of a group of five different roots. These roots all have different linguistic sources but were perhaps readily incorporated into the Hebrew language due to similar or related meanings, more or less:
(swr) is the assumed root of the words (sawwar), neck and (sawwaron), necklace. The neck is simply a part of the body, but figuratively it is used as seat of strength (Job 39:19) and subsequently as target of defeat (by the placing of the victor's foot on the neck of the conquered - Joshua 10:24). The similarity between a necklace and a besieging army is obvious.
The verb (sur) means to bind or besiege; referred to above.
The verb (sur) means show hostility to, be an adversary. According to BDB Theological Dictionary and HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is probably a by-form of (sarar), see below.
The verb (sur) means to form or fashion. According to HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is possibly a by-form of (yasar), form or fashion.
The noun (sur) does not occur in the Bible, but is probably related to words in cognate languages that mean rock or hill. A derivative that does occur in the Bible is (sur), the common Biblical word for rock. BDB Theological Dictionary suggests relations with (sara), see below.

The words and are linguistically closely related. Their respective meanings also shows much kinship:
The verb (sarar) means to bind, be narrow/ confined, be in distress. Derivatives are: (sar), narrow, tight; (sar), distress; (sara), straights, distress; (sarar), suffer distress; (seror), bundle; (mesar), straights, distress. The latter word written in a dual form would yield the name , Mizraim. Jones' Dictionary of Old Testament Proper Names assumed that this is what Mizraim would have meant to a Hebrew audience and reads Double Distress.
The verb (sarar) means show hostility towards. Derivation (sar) means adversary.
The assumed root (srr) is unused in the Bible but in Arabic it means be sharp. Its common derivative is (sar), pebble, flint.

The name Mizraim means Double Distress or Double Stronghold.



Bible Dictionary

Mizraim definition


the dual form of matzor, meaning a "mound" or "fortress," the name of a people descended from Ham (Gen. 10:6, 13; 1 Chr. 1:8, 11). It was the name generally given by the Hebrews to the land of Egypt (q.v.), and may denote the two Egypts, the Upper and the Lower. The modern Arabic name for Egypt is Muzr.


Mizraim From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mizraim
Mizraim (Hebrew: מִצְרַיִם / מִצְרָיִם, Modern Mitzráyim Tiberian Miṣrāyim / Miṣráyim ; cf. Arabic مصر, Miṣr) is the Hebrew name for the land of Egypt, with the dual suffix -āyim, perhaps referring to the "two Egypts": Upper Egypt and Lower Egypt.

Ugaritic inscriptions refer to Egypt as Msrm, in the Amarna tablets it is called Misri, and Assyrian and Babylonian records called Egypt Musur and Musri. The Arabic word for Egypt is Misr (pronounced Masr in Egyptian colloquial Arabic), and Egypt's official name is Gumhuriyah Misr al-'Arabiyah (the Arab Republic of Egypt).

According to Genesis 10, Mizraim (a son of Ham) was the younger brother of Cush and elder brother of Phut and Canaan, whose families together made up the Hamite branch of Noah's descendants. Mizraim's sons were Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, Casluhim (out of whom came Philistim), and Caphtorim.[1]

According to Eusebius' Chronicon, Manetho had suggested that the great age of antiquity in which the later Egyptians boasted had actually preceded the flood, and that they were really descended from Mizraim, who settled there anew. A similar story is related by medieval Islamic historians such as Sibt ibn al-Jawzi, the Egyptian Ibn Abd-el-Hakem, and the Persians al-Tabari and Muhammad Khwandamir, stating that the pyramids, etc. had been built by the wicked races before the deluge, but that Noah's descendant Mizraim (Masar or Mesr) was entrusted with reoccupying the region afterward. The Islamic accounts also make Masar the son of a Bansar or Beisar and grandson of Ham, rather than a direct son of Ham, and add that he lived to the age of 700. Some scholars think it likely that Mizraim is a dual form of the word Misr meaning "land", and was translated literally into Ancient Egyptian as Ta-Wy (the Two Lands) by early pharaohs at Thebes, who later founded the Middle Kingdom.

But according to George Syncellus, the Book of Sothis, supposedly by Manetho, had identified Mizraim with the legendary first pharaoh Menes, said to have unified the Old Kingdom and built Memphis. Misraim also seems to correspond to Misor, said in Phoenician mythology to have been father of Taautus who was given Egypt, and later scholars noticed that this also recalls Menes, whose son or successor was said to be Athothis.

In Judaism, Mitzrayim has been connected with the word meitzar (מיצר), meaning "sea strait", possibly alluding to narrow gulfs from both sides of Sinai peninsula. It also can mean "boundaries, limits, restrictions" or "narrow place".[citation needed]

However, author David Rohl has suggested a different interpretation: "Amongst the followers of Meskiagkasher [Cush] was his younger 'brother' -- in his own right a strong and charismatic leader of men. He is the head of the falcon tribe -- the descendants of Horus the 'Far Distant'. The Bible calls this new Horus-king 'Mizraim' but this name is, in reality, no more than an epithet. It means 'follower of Asr' or 'Asar' (Arabic m-asr with the Egyptian preposition m 'from'). Mizraim is merely m-Izra with the majestic plural ending 'im'. Likewise, that other great Semitic-speaking people -- the Assyrians -- called the country of the pharaohs 'Musri' (m-Usri)." [2]


Genesis 10 - The Table of Nations
http://www.enduringword.com/commentaries/0110.htm
The tenth chapter of Genesis . . . stands absolutely alone in ancient literature, without a remote parallel, even among the Greeks, where we find the closest approach to a distribution of peoples in genealogical framework . . . The Table of Nations remains an astonishing accurate document. (William F. Albright, cited in Boice)

A. The descendants of Japheth.

1. (1) The three sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

Now this is the genealogy of the sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth. And sons were born to them after the flood.

2. (2) The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

The sons of Japheth were Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

a. The sons of Japheth: He was the father of the Indo-European peoples, those stretching from India to the shores of Western Europe. They are each linked by linguistic similarities that often seem invisible to the layman but are much more obvious to the linguist.

b. Gomer: From this son of Japheth came the Germanic peoples, from whom came most of the original peoples of Western Europe. These include the original French, Spanish, and Celtic settlers.

c. Magog . . . Tubal, Meshech: These settled in the far north of Europe and became the Russian peoples.

d. Madai: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Medes and they populated what are now Iran and Iraq. The peoples of India also came from this branch of Japheth’s family.

e. Javan: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Greeks, whose sea-faring ways are described in Genesis 10:5.

3. (3) The sons of Gomer.

The sons of Gomer were Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah.

a. Ashkenaz: From this son of Gomer came the peoples who settled north of Judea into what we call the Fertile Crescent.

b. Togarmah: From this son of Gomer came the Armenians.

4. (4-5) The sons of Javan (the ancient Greeks).

The sons of Javan were Elishah, Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim. From these the coastland peoples of the Gentiles were separated into their lands, everyone according to his language, according to their families, into their nations.

a. The sons of Javan were: Geographic names that spring from these names in this chapter abound. Linguists have no trouble seeing the connection between Kittim and Cyprus, Rodanim and Rhodes, Gomer and Germany, Meschech and Moscow, Tubal and Tobolsk.

B. The descendants of Ham.

1. (6) The sons of Ham: Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

The sons of Ham were Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

a. Ham: The descendants of Ham are the peoples who populated Africa and the Far East.

b. Cush: Apparently, this family divided into two branches early. Some founded Babylon (notably, Nimrod) and others founded Ethiopia.

c. Mizraim: This is another way the Bible refers to Egypt. Put refers to Libya, the region of North Africa west of Egypt. Canaan refers to the peoples who originally settled the land we today think of as Israel and its surrounding regions.
2. (7-12) The sons of Cush.

The sons of Cush were Seba, Havilah, Sabtah, Raamah, and Sabtechah; and the sons of Raamah were Sheba and Dedan. Cush begot Nimrod; he began to be a mighty one on the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord; therefore it is said, “Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord.” And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, Erech, Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar. From that land he went to Assyria and built Nineveh, Rehoboth Ir, Calah, and Resen between Nineveh and Calah (that is the principal city).



a. Cush begot Nimrod: One son of Cush worthy of note is Nimrod. He was a mighty one on the earth, but not in a good way. He ruled over Babel, which was the first organized rebellion of humans against God. The name Nimrod itself means, “let us rebel.”



b. Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord: The context shows that this is not a compliment of Nimrod. The idea is that Nimrod was an offense before the face of God.



i. “This is not talking about Nimrod’s ability to hunt wild game. He was not a hunter of animals. He was a hunter of men - a warrior. It was through his ability to fight and kill and rule ruthlessly that his kingdom of the Euphrates valley city states was consolidated.” (Boice)



ii. A Jerusalem Targum says: “He was powerful in hunting and in wickedness before the Lord, for he was a hunter of the sons of men, and he said to them, ‘Depart from the judgment of the Lord, and adhere to the judgment of Nimrod!’ Therefore it is said: ‘As Nimrod the strong one, strong in hunting, and in wickedness before the Lord.’ ”



iii. Ginzberg quotes from a Jewish legend: “The great success that attended all of Nimrod’s undertakings produced a sinister effect. Men no longer trusted in God, but rather in their own prowess and ability, an attitude to which Nimrod tried to convert the whole world.”

iv. “Hence it is likely that Nimrod, having acquired power, used it in tyranny and oppression; and by rapine and violence founded the domination which was the first distinguished by the name of a kingdom on the face of the earth. How many kingdoms have been founded in the same way, in various ages and nations from that time to the present! From the Nimrods of the earth, God deliver the world!” (Clarke)

3. (13-14) The sons of Mizraim.

Mizraim begot Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, and Casluhim (from whom came the Philistines and Caphtorim).

4. (15-19) The sons of Canaan.

Canaan begot Sidon his firstborn, and Heth; the Jebusite, the Amorite, and the Girgashite; the Hivite, the Arkite, and the Sinite; the Arvadite, the Zemarite, and the Hamathite. Afterward the families of the Canaanites were dispersed. And the border of the Canaanites was from Sidon as you go toward Gerar, as far as Gaza; then as you go toward Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboiim, as far as Lasha.

a. Canaan begot Sidon: The family of Sidon, the son of Canaan, went north and is related to the Hittites and Lebanese.

b. And the Sinite: Many people believe the Oriental peoples descended from the Sinites.

5. (20) The spread of the descendants of Ham.

These were the sons of Ham, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands and in their nations.

C. The descendants of Shem.

1. (21-22) The sons of Shem: Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

And children were born also to Shem, the father of all the children of Eber, the brother of Japheth the elder. The sons of Shem were Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

a. Children were born also to Shem: From Shem comes Elam, who was an ancestor to the Persian peoples; Asshur, who was the father of the Assyrians; Lud was father to the Lydians who lived for a time in Asia Minor; and Aram was father to the Arameans, who we also know as the Syrians. Arphaxad was the ancestor to Abram and the Hebrews.

2. (23) The sons of Aram.

The sons of Aram were Uz, Hul, Gether, and Mash.

a. Uz: Later, a region in Arabia was named after this son of Aram.

Job came from the land of Uz (Job 1:1).

3. (24-30) The sons and descendants of Arphaxad.

Arphaxad begot Salah, and Salah begot Eber. To Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg, for in his days the earth was divided; and his brother’s name was Joktan. Joktan begot Almodad, Sheleph, Hazarmaveth, Jerah, Hadoram, Uzal, Diklah, Obal, Abimael, Sheba, Ophir, Havilah, and Jobab. All these were the sons of Joktan. And their dwelling place was from Mesha as you go toward Sephar, the mountain of the east.

a. All these were the sons of Joktan: The names under the son of Joktan (son of Eber, son of Salah, son of Arphaxad) are all associated with various Arabic peoples.

b. And Jobab: The one named Jobab may be the one we know as Job in the Old Testament.

4. (31) The spread of the descendants of Shem.

These were the sons of Shem, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands, according to their nations.
5. (32) Summary statement: the nations after the flood.

These were the families of the sons of Noah, according to their generations, in their nations; and from these the nations were divided on the earth after the flood.

a. “Hence one must consider this chapter of Genesis a mirror in which to discern that we human beings are, namely, creatures so marred by sin that we have no knowledge of our own origin, not even of God Himself, our Creator, unless the Word of God reveals these sparks of divine light to us from afar . . . This knowledge the Holy Scriptures reveal to us. Those who are without them live in error, uncertainty, and boundless ungodliness; for they have no knowledge about who they are and whence they came.” (Luther, cited in Boice)
thumbs up


MIZRAIM = EGYPT

thumbs up popcorn

You also deceive about the Replacement/Superssessionism Theology......This is Strike 3 and a few more to go. thumbs up

http://www.biblestudyproject.org/israel3.1-replacement-theology-messianic.htm

The Truth

We believe Israel is God's special people, distinct from the body of Messiah, chosen by Him to be a holy nation and a Kingdom of priests. The election of Israel is irrevocable. . . . We believe the Abrahamic Covenant is an irrevocable, unconditional covenant God made with Jewish people. This covenant provides title to the land of Israel for the Jewish people and promises a descendant (the Messiah) who would come to redeem Israel and bless the entire world. The spiritual blessings of the Abrahamic Covenant overflow to all the nations. God will ultimately fulfill every aspect of the covenant in the Messianic Kingdom, both physical and spiritual. . . .
thumbs up

Your LIE!!!!!!!

A. SUPERSESSIONISM OR REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY

The meaning of this doctrine is that the church superseded or replaced Israel as God's covenant people. The three claims presented under this heading are:
1. God has rejected Israel,
2. the church has replaced Israel as God's covenant people, and
3. the church is therefore spiritual Israel.

If God has rejected Israel, then that clears the way for a replacement people; and if that people is the church, then the church may be considered spiritual Israel. It is also conceivable that some who believe that Israel is still God's covenant people would consider the church spiritual Israel because it is composed of people whose spirits have been regenerated by the Holy Spirit. We will now hold the light of Scripture to these claims and possibilities.
thumbs down


Paul follows his emphatic response with, for I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. . . . What is his point? If God had rejected Israel as His covenant people, then every Israelite would be disqualified from the possibility of being saved; yet he is an Israelite who is saved, and that proves that God has not rejected His people.

To sum up, we have noticed two proofs that God has not rejected Israel as His covenant people:
1. By the very meaning of May it never be! in the way that Paul used it in different contexts.
2. By the fact that Paul was a saved Israelite.


Nevertheless, we'll address several passages that need clarification.

b. Romans 11:1-5

1. I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2. God has not rejected His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says in the passage about Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel? 3. "Lord, THEY HAVE KILLED YOUR PROPHETS, THEY HAVE TORN DOWN YOUR ALTARS, AND I ALONE AM LEFT, AND THEY ARE SEEKING MY LIFE." 4. But what is the divine response to him? "I HAVE KEPT for Myself SEVEN THOUSAND MEN WHO HAVE NOT BOWED THE KNEE TO BAAL." 5. In the same way then, there has also come to be at the present time a remnant according to God's gracious choice.



Replacement Theology

Its Origins, Teachings and Errors

By Dr. Gary Hedrick, President of CJF Ministries

(With Minor Editing By Rabbi Loren)

http://www.shema.com/Combating%20Replacement%20Theology/crt-004.php

http://www.therefinersfire.org/replacement_theology.htm

These are serious errors/deformations in your Theology and Worldview. What do you have to say for yourself. You gibber on and on about being persecuted yet you, yourself; are the persecuter. You lie about the Jews and their Sacred scriptures and you attempt to steal their identity and destiny, without being able to read/write Hebrew. Your ignorance and hubris is appalling Capiche? thumbs up


thumbs up

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wacky

boobies
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  true lilly on Mon Nov 07, 2011 3:25 pm

"tintin" WORSE than "Yellow"...
a LOVER of LIES, PLAGIARIST
(NOT a CREATIVE bone in him),
ANTI CREATOR, ANTI CREATION,
ANTI LIFE, ANTI TRUTH, and,
ANTI ANYONE DOING or RECEIVING
JUSTICE...
because NONE of HIS SELF GLORYING
is Justly earned or maintained...

ALL HE DOES is HUNT SACRIFICIAL Lambs
TO THROW to HIS WOLVES, and their
BLOODY REMAINS AT OTHER
WEAK, POWERLESS, INNOCENTS...

and, CAN'T SHUT UP about
WHAT A GREAT JOKE IT IS TO HIM
Evil or Very Mad
http://forum.davidicke.com/showthread.php?t=11956&page=3207
EVIL!

nope...not it yet...but compare how MANY 'names'
VIOLENTLY STORM against me, for daring to SHOW
that GOD'S WORD DOES DESCRIBE AUSTRALIA
to BE ZION, FOR ALL ISRAEL and FRIENDS...
...and NOTE 'THOSE NAMES' CALL FOR THE
DESTRUCTION of ISRAEL and FRIENDS...AND,
WANT THIS GLORIOUS LAND FOR THEMSELVES!


true lilly wrote:
So that's how you get a bloke to the shops...
The much-anticipated third instalment in
the Call of Duty franchise was
released at midnight, to the delight of
fans waiting at EB Games.
Picture: Fiona Hamilton
Read More
SEVERE STORM
WARNING FOR VICTORIA

Severe storm warning for Victoria

6:27AM
Nathan Mawby

UPDATE 7am:

STORMS and lightning
sweep through Melbourne,
with the weather bureau

warning the worst is yet to come.

Biggest war of them all
VIDEO: Gamers turned out at midnight for
the launch of the highly anticipated
Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3

P.S. these are ALL on Today's MURDOCH Herald Sun
FRONT PAGE.
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  Ciggy on Mon Nov 07, 2011 7:22 pm

Fuckall to do with anythimg as usual.
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  true lilly on Tue Nov 08, 2011 7:42 pm

Earthquakes, Volcanoes...
...man and his MYTHS have
NEVER been able to SAVE anything...


...whereas, GOD TOLD US, HE CREATED LIFE,
and WITH HIM, ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE.


The Pompeii worm was found in the 1980s


Its family name Alvinellidae and genus name Alvinella
both derive from DSV Alvin, the three-person
submersible vehicle used during the discovery of
hydrothermal vents and their fauna
during the late 1970s.


Deep sea vents in the Atlantic Ocean’s Mid-Atlantic Ridge
support
tubeworms, eelpout fish, and crabs.
The Mid-Atlantic Ridge is an
underwater mountain chain
that extends about 10,000 miles (16,000
kilometers)
from the Arctic Ocean to the southern tip of Africa.
Water heated as high as 760°F (404°C)
by magma from Earth's interior
billows from a seafloor chimney.

http://environment.nationalgeographic.com/environment/habitats/deep-sea-vents/

Sadly, most don't use their access to the internet
for edifying education...and end up paying dearly,
trying to satisfy lusts and 'get rich', because they
didn't care to learn to Serve Just life...

Computer seized at couple's home

Anthony Dowsley and Mark Buttler
UPDATE 8.42am:
POLICE have confirmed they spoke to a couple
and seized their computer
on the day they went missing.

dixie dean wrote:
09-11-2011, 12:18 AM #32097
Quote:
Originally Posted by stormrider73

I'm a "Targeted Individual" aka TI
You could reverse Targeted Individual to Individually Targeted which would give you IT.

When you put IT into Wiki you get three pages come up...

It (novel), It (film) and Information Technology

It might be worth keeping that in mind,

Last edited by dixie d; 09-11-2011 at 12:19 AM.
...and NO, you EVIL DICK "TINTIN", YOU DIDN'T 'predict' ANYTHING!

YOU PLOT, and PULL SOME OFF, but FRAZIER'S DEATH WAS EXPECTED,
AND WIDELY REPORTED IN THE MSN, BEFORE YOU, MORE (NOT less),
posted FISTS of YOUR EXCREMENTAL words, dates & images, TO LATER,
INSANELY EXPECT others to believe a CHERRY PICKED FEW, 'predicted'
SHIT!

But what EXPOSES YOU and YOUR OTHER 'names', IS THE LUST with
which YOU GLOAT and TRY TO PERSONALLY BOAST OF, DEATHS.
http://forum.davidicke.com/showthread.php?t=11956&page=3210
dixie dean wrote: 08-11-2011, 12:59 PM #32079
Quote:
Originally Posted by cori



JOE FRAZIER died
Frazier was diagnosed with liver cancer in late September 2011 and admitted to hospice care.[3] He died November 7, 2011.

November 7 is 117 or 711 reveresed. I also wondered if Smoking Joe might have any reference to Volcano

Quote:
Black smokers or deep sea vents are an example of this kind of volcanic activity.
Last edited by dixie d; 08-11-2011 at 01:00 PM.


true lilly wrote:30-10-2007, 04:33 PM #499
Quote:
Originally Posted by armoured saint

It's not like you have checked and
compared DNA samples of these as opposed to groups of people in the
middleast, egypt and south america as well as the Aborigines. So, how
did Moses get to Australia from south America and yet the source of the
story comes from either Egypt, middle or near east.

Don't tell me Noah built the 'Abel Tasman' and then handed it down to Moses somehow.

I like your font colouring. It dazzles the senses. Puts "King Of The Mountain" to shame.

And here we have it again folks, that DESPERATE NEED TO WORSHIP EGYPT,
The City of The DEATH CULT.

Now this 'character' is NOT unfamiliar with all that's been posted on this topic,
yet comes up with a childish, "Oh yeah!" post like this.

Now as for comparing DNA; it has been done and in the news, that native
Australians ARE THE OLDEST, PUREST Blooded peoples.
Related closest to the OLDEST PUREST SOUTH AMERICANS and Africans,
who in THEIR OWN ORAL HISTORY tell of NOT ORIGINATING in Africa.

So, AT LEAST 60,000 years of the LONGEST CONTINUOUS Cultures,
of the 'OLDEST' peoples, who's DREAMING STORIES ARE the Consistently
CLOSEST FITS TO GENESIS...but we'll just IGNORE ALL THAT and
"keep looking for" "where they came from"??!!!

The CLOSEST RELATED FLORA & FAUNA to OZ NATIVES, are South American.

'Jerusalem' wasn't GIVEN that name until around 1000 Year AFTER
Alexander The Great DELUDED PUPPET of his Twisted Mother, told
the world an ORACLE in EGYPT "told him" that "HE WAS THE SON of 'god'".

That's a THOUSAND YEARS of the MOST POWERFUL, ANTI-CHRIST
EMPIRES FORCING their 'history' down the throats of powerless,

uneducated peoples, with things like the CONTINUED BLOODY INQUISITIONS
that SLAUGHTERED, PRIMARILY, CHRISTIANS who would NOT accept ROME'S
COUNTERFEIT.

But "THEY" want YOU to IGNORE that Holy Scripture ALSO DESCRIBES
the NATURAL HISTORY that Science is finally catching up with; IGNORE
that Holy Scripture DESCRIBES the WHOLE World,
FROM THE TIME of The Super-Continent before that River Head became a SEA,
that "They", without foundation, RE-named the Euphrates.

In fact IGNORE ALL Holy Scripture, according to "Them" it's all a fairy tale,
EXCEPT THE BITS KNOWN TO BE CHANGED, in order TO SELL EGYPT'S
DEATH WORSHIP CULT!

Now long after Joshua died, after winning wars ON FOOT against Mounted
Armies and HAMSTRINGING all their BEASTS OF BURDEN (which is what those
'horses' and 'camels' are), they FORGOT Their God and History and were
DRIVEN OUT OF ZION (which included the UTTER DEVASTATION of the land
that The Creator also Promised He would cause to BLOOM RICH again when
the Lost, Scattered, Mixed and Mingled Israel, started returning), which
was when those Old Cultures of Asia took off, and the GENETIC MIX of
peoples across the world and into NORTHERN Europe SUPPORTS this.

And so does what VERY LITTLE Archeology had been done in this land;
a Large Corralling of Different, Large, Unknown DOMESTIC Animals.

But be patient, we'd need over 500 of these pages to catch up on all the
evidences for this case, that "this poster" KNOWS we've covered elsewhere.

It's the COUNTERFEITING "Jesuit Trained" scholars and "those who
say they are Jews but are NOT", who INVENTED that ONLY around 6000 year age
of the world according to ROMES 'bible'.

Holy Scripture DESCRIBES a MUCH OLDER AGE,
RIGHT BACK TO BEFORE MAN LIVED ON THE SUPER-CONTINENT.
true lilly wrote:Re: Aboriginal Stonehenge:
Stargazing in ancient Australia
true lilly Today, 9-11-2011 at 12:53 am
Geology
Prehistory of Antarctica



Map showing details of Gondwana break-up, including glacial scouring
as Australia moved northwards.
(Map: R Beaman)


Like all other continents, Antarctica has at its core an ancient
shield. The rocks of the East Antarctica shield are as old as 4 billion
years, which means that they are amongst the oldest known rocks on
Earth. Geologists are now studying this shield to help them gain insight
into the early geological processes of the Earth’s history.


In many ways, the evolution of Antarctica appears to be similar to
that of Australia.
The fossil record of the two continents is similar,
and Antarctica has yielded dinosaurs, amphibians and even marsupials
from ages when the continents were joined.


The position of the continents shifts constantly and the geography of
today's world is vastly different from what it was even a hundred
million years ago. Twenty million years before the dinosaurs became
extinct, Australia, Antarctica and South America were part of the same
land mass called Gondwana. In those days Antarctica was not covered in
ice, even though it was at the South Pole. Animals passed freely from
South America through Antarctica to Australia, and the plant species of
Gondwana were also closely related to each other.


Eighty five million years ago Australia began to separate from Antarctica.
The separation started slowly at first at a rate of only a few millimetres a year.
This then accelerated to the present rate of 7 cm a year.
Australia completely separated from Antarctica about 30 million years ago.


Scientists in Antarctica have discovered fossilised spores and pollen
of sundews, Nothofagus (which includes the Tasmanian myrtle
N. cunninghamii and the Tasmanian deciduous beech N. gunnii ).
The Tasmanian tree fern and creeping pine, are derived from forms which
once inhabited Australia and Antarctica.

Scientists were recently excited by a fossil discovery of twigs, roots, leaves
and pollen in Antarctica, of a form which is virtually indistinguishable
from Nothofagus gunnii , the Tasmanian deciduous beech.

These fossils may be ‘only’ 3 million years old.

This implies that Antarctica was not entirely covered by ice at that time.
Previous to this find, scientists had thought that Antarctica cooled and
became ice bound after Australia and South America separated
30 million years ago, allowing the Circumpolar Current to develop.
Scientists are still debating the age and significance of this
fossil discovery.


Antarctica without its ice

Casey: the Daintree of Antarctica

People who consider Antarctica to be a small continent will be
surprised to discover that it is larger than Europe and nearly twice the
size of Australia. The Antarctic continent, excluding its ice shelves,
covers over 13 million square kilometres compared with 7.7 million km²
for Australia, or 10.5 million km² for Europe. The map below gives some
idea of relative size.




Ninety-nine percent of Antarctica has a permanent blanket of snow and ice.
Only about one percent of the continent's rock base is visible
where it pokes through the ice sheet in the form of coastal outcrops,
mountain ranges or ‘nunataks’ which are isolated peaks.


The Transantarctic Mountains divide the continent into two
contrasting parts, the East and West. The Transantarctic Mountains
constitute one of the world’s longest and most impressive mountain
chains. They extend from the north western corner of the Ross Sea to the
south western corner of the Weddell Sea. West Antarctica, which
includes the Antarctic Peninsula, is smaller and has a complex
geological history. West Antarctica consists of four land units each
with a different history. There has been major volcanic activity here in
recent geological times and there are still a few active volcanic
centres.
Deep waters exist between land units and the West Antarctic ice
sheet, which can be considered to a be floating ice mass, held in place
by land peaks. West Antarctica includes the Vinson Massif, which has
the highest peak in Antarctica at 5140 metres.


Most of East Antarctica is still not well known by geologists but it
does include the Transantarctic Mountains.
These commonly exceed 4000
metres elevation. The shield is very depressed in the centre, where it
carries the bulk of the Antarctic ice sheet. Large areas lie deeper than
1000 metres below sea level.


Mining Antarctica

There are deposits of minerals such as coal and iron ore, but there
are vast economic and technical difficulties associated with the
recovery of mineral deposits. The Antarctic ice cover is, on average,
2.5 km thick and this means that very little of the land is accessible
for exploration, so work would have to take place under the ice sheet.
The difficult Antarctic conditions, evenwhen the technology works well
elsewhere make exploitation unlikely.
Once minerals are mined, Antarctica is a long way from world markets,
and material would have to be transported over the treacherous Southern
Ocean. Cheaper sources exist elsewhere in the world, and these will be
exploited before Antarctic sources.


So far, the economics of extracting resources from the harsh
Antarctic environment have prevented any commercial operations, but
Antarctica's climate may not protect its minerals indefinitely. What can
prevent such exploitation is a strong, well-supported international
agreement. Nations of the Antarctic Treaty System agreed in 1991 to put a
halt to the exploitation of minerals when they signed a comprehensive
Protocol on Environmental Protection (the Madrid Protocol), which banned
mining in Antarctica indefinitely. This important agreement came into
force in January 1998.

Read more about mining in Antarctica


Glossopteris (Fossil) leaf Permian age, Prince Charles Mountains.
(Photo: R Oldfield; Cat: 4766C1)


Antarctic prehistory facts
http://www.antarctica.gov.au/about-antarctica/fact-files/geology/antarctic-prehistory-facts

One more time, FROM THE BEGINNING...

Lebanon = "whiteness"
1) a wooded mountain range on the northern border of Israel

LEBANON

http://www.blueletterbible.org/search/translationResults.cfm?Criteria=lebanon&t=KJV

Every place 4725 whereon the soles 3709 of your feet 7272 shall tread 1869
shall be yours: from the wilderness 4057 and Lebanon 3844,
from the river 5104, the river 5104 Euphrates 6578,
even unto the uttermost 314 sea 3220 shall your coast 1366 be.


LABAN

http://www.blueletterbible.org/search/translationResults.cfm?Criteria=laban&t=KJV&sf=5

And Isaac 3327 sent away 7971 Jacob 3290:
and he went 3212 to Padanaram 6307 unto Laban 3837,
son 1121 of Bethuel 1328 the Syrian 761, the brother 251 of Rebekah 7259,
Jacob's 3290 and Esau's 6215 mother 517.

I left school at 14, not that I went much before then, as by 8, I knew
there was something about The Time Line, we weren't being taught, and
that, 'That Something' had to do with GOD.
Not that I left EDUCATION, I was doing my Horsemasters Diploma by 13,
and continued self education, all my life, taking interest in whatever any expert
on anything had to share.

Seekwith your whole heart and whole mind. That's what I set out to do,
and not so much 'despite', but 'because' of the many false paths I'd cross
and take, I discovered that faith, inThe Creator and The Truth of His Word,
was the only thing that led me past knowledge, to understanding,
and discovery, of yet more knowledge and understanding.

As I came to understand that just as Australia was 'presented' to be a
land of 'no historic value', my lack of deep interest in the deep sea
and Antarctica, was born of how they were 'presented'.

But my most deep interest was always in seeking to know God, which again,
led me to 'KNOW', what I'm still only discovering, others have long known...and
I should not keep having to argue the facts of.

God Exists!
God Described All The World, All The Earth and All Peoples,
From The Beginning.

And, God Does KEEP ALL HIS PROMISES.

P.S. and all the CRAP "Ciggy & Co.=Team TINTIN" keep,
REPEAT, REPEAT, REPEATING, "They" KNOW I've been
SHOWING TO BE "Their" DELIBERATE DECEPTIVE DISTRACTION,
since back in 2005, when I first went on line, and started being
BANNED from further expounding, and being LITERALLY, PHYSICALLY,
FINANCIALLY and Socially ATTACKED, BY "Them", Again.
As I always have been, when I refuse to blame God, for "THEIR" EVILS.


But see, when others of the hippy era, were PREACHING, "God doesn't exist",
I kept looking for His Promised Revealing Proofs, that He Creates AND SAVES
LIFE...and kept finding more and more...


PINK HAIRY SQUAT LOBSTER (Lauriea siagiani) - ©Scott Penny

They are not lobsters at all, but are more closely related to
porcelain crabs, hermit crabs and then, more distantly, true crabs.
They are distributed worldwide in the oceans, and occur from near the
surface to deep sea hydrothermal vents.

There are currently 870 described species.

They live on Giant Barrel Sponges. These squat lobsters are
remarkably colored, with their intense pink body, purple spots, and
bright yellow hairs that protrude in all directions.

Fossil squat lobsters have been found in strata
dating back to the Middle Jurassic of Europe.


Fact Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squat_lobster
http://www.thefeaturedcreature.com/#axzz1GGJ7mEM7

Deep-Sea Volcanoes
Don't Just Produce Lava Flows,
They Also Explode

ScienceDaily (Mar. 28, 2011)


http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/03/110328151734.htm
...and if you insist on believing that THE RELIGIONS PREACHED
by ANTI-LIFE GREENIE God Mockers can 'save you', KNOW that
GOD ALSO WARNED that WILLINGLY BLIND FAITH in MAN'S LIES,
CAN'T 'save'!
BUT GOD CAN and DOES, CREATE LIFE FROM NOTHING,
and RESURRECTS The 'dead' WHO DIDN'T DENY,
HIS HOLY SPIRIT of TRUTH.
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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  sharky on Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:37 am

el kabong wrote: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia thumbs up

Europe is a LARGER Continent then Australia. As a matter of FACT; Australia is the SMALLEST/RUNT Continent. And as large it may be, the size of your EGO makes it uncomfortably confining. But hey, that's only one of your many lies and deceptions. Let's talk about Mizraim, the Hebrew word for Egypt. You say it isn't. Where is your credentialed support for your ignorant nonsense? thumbs up

http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Mizraim.html

Meaning and etymology of the name Mizraim
Mizraim


Mizraim is a son of Ham, son of Noah (Genesis 12:10). This name is also the common name for Egypt (which is also known as 'the land of Ham,', for instance in Psalm 105:23).

Egypt was known by the names Musuru, Musru, Misir or Masri in other languages, and Mizraim is probably simply a phonetic transliteration into Hebrew of any of them. The word looks identical to what a dual form of would look like (see below). This duality possibly helped to denote Upper and Lower Egypt. The word for Egyptian is .

The similar (masor), a poetic nickname for Egypt that is used on three different occasions (Isaiah 19:6, 2 Kings 19:24 = Isaiah 37:25, Micah 7:12), may shed some understanding on how a Hebrew audience might have interpreted the name Mizraim.

The noun (masor) means siege, entrenchment, and it derives from the verb (sur), bind, besiege. Another derivation of this same verb is the noun , stronghold. HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament notes that a stronghold or walled city may be an instrument of protection during the first stages of a war, but will turn into a lethal trap if a siege last long. A beautiful figurative use of this word occurs in Psalm 31:21, where the author compares himself under siege by his troubles.

The verb from which the noun derives, is part of a group of five different roots. These roots all have different linguistic sources but were perhaps readily incorporated into the Hebrew language due to similar or related meanings, more or less:
(swr) is the assumed root of the words (sawwar), neck and (sawwaron), necklace. The neck is simply a part of the body, but figuratively it is used as seat of strength (Job 39:19) and subsequently as target of defeat (by the placing of the victor's foot on the neck of the conquered - Joshua 10:24). The similarity between a necklace and a besieging army is obvious.
The verb (sur) means to bind or besiege; referred to above.
The verb (sur) means show hostility to, be an adversary. According to BDB Theological Dictionary and HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is probably a by-form of (sarar), see below.
The verb (sur) means to form or fashion. According to HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is possibly a by-form of (yasar), form or fashion.
The noun (sur) does not occur in the Bible, but is probably related to words in cognate languages that mean rock or hill. A derivative that does occur in the Bible is (sur), the common Biblical word for rock. BDB Theological Dictionary suggests relations with (sara), see below.

The words and are linguistically closely related. Their respective meanings also shows much kinship:
The verb (sarar) means to bind, be narrow/ confined, be in distress. Derivatives are: (sar), narrow, tight; (sar), distress; (sara), straights, distress; (sarar), suffer distress; (seror), bundle; (mesar), straights, distress. The latter word written in a dual form would yield the name , Mizraim. Jones' Dictionary of Old Testament Proper Names assumed that this is what Mizraim would have meant to a Hebrew audience and reads Double Distress.
The verb (sarar) means show hostility towards. Derivation (sar) means adversary.
The assumed root (srr) is unused in the Bible but in Arabic it means be sharp. Its common derivative is (sar), pebble, flint.

The name Mizraim means Double Distress or Double Stronghold.



Bible Dictionary

Mizraim definition


the dual form of matzor, meaning a "mound" or "fortress," the name of a people descended from Ham (Gen. 10:6, 13; 1 Chr. 1:8, 11). It was the name generally given by the Hebrews to the land of Egypt (q.v.), and may denote the two Egypts, the Upper and the Lower. The modern Arabic name for Egypt is Muzr.


Mizraim From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mizraim
Mizraim (Hebrew: מִצְרַיִם / מִצְרָיִם, Modern Mitzráyim Tiberian Miṣrāyim / Miṣráyim ; cf. Arabic مصر, Miṣr) is the Hebrew name for the land of Egypt, with the dual suffix -āyim, perhaps referring to the "two Egypts": Upper Egypt and Lower Egypt.

Ugaritic inscriptions refer to Egypt as Msrm, in the Amarna tablets it is called Misri, and Assyrian and Babylonian records called Egypt Musur and Musri. The Arabic word for Egypt is Misr (pronounced Masr in Egyptian colloquial Arabic), and Egypt's official name is Gumhuriyah Misr al-'Arabiyah (the Arab Republic of Egypt).

According to Genesis 10, Mizraim (a son of Ham) was the younger brother of Cush and elder brother of Phut and Canaan, whose families together made up the Hamite branch of Noah's descendants. Mizraim's sons were Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, Casluhim (out of whom came Philistim), and Caphtorim.[1]

According to Eusebius' Chronicon, Manetho had suggested that the great age of antiquity in which the later Egyptians boasted had actually preceded the flood, and that they were really descended from Mizraim, who settled there anew. A similar story is related by medieval Islamic historians such as Sibt ibn al-Jawzi, the Egyptian Ibn Abd-el-Hakem, and the Persians al-Tabari and Muhammad Khwandamir, stating that the pyramids, etc. had been built by the wicked races before the deluge, but that Noah's descendant Mizraim (Masar or Mesr) was entrusted with reoccupying the region afterward. The Islamic accounts also make Masar the son of a Bansar or Beisar and grandson of Ham, rather than a direct son of Ham, and add that he lived to the age of 700. Some scholars think it likely that Mizraim is a dual form of the word Misr meaning "land", and was translated literally into Ancient Egyptian as Ta-Wy (the Two Lands) by early pharaohs at Thebes, who later founded the Middle Kingdom.

But according to George Syncellus, the Book of Sothis, supposedly by Manetho, had identified Mizraim with the legendary first pharaoh Menes, said to have unified the Old Kingdom and built Memphis. Misraim also seems to correspond to Misor, said in Phoenician mythology to have been father of Taautus who was given Egypt, and later scholars noticed that this also recalls Menes, whose son or successor was said to be Athothis.

In Judaism, Mitzrayim has been connected with the word meitzar (מיצר), meaning "sea strait", possibly alluding to narrow gulfs from both sides of Sinai peninsula. It also can mean "boundaries, limits, restrictions" or "narrow place".[citation needed]

However, author David Rohl has suggested a different interpretation: "Amongst the followers of Meskiagkasher [Cush] was his younger 'brother' -- in his own right a strong and charismatic leader of men. He is the head of the falcon tribe -- the descendants of Horus the 'Far Distant'. The Bible calls this new Horus-king 'Mizraim' but this name is, in reality, no more than an epithet. It means 'follower of Asr' or 'Asar' (Arabic m-asr with the Egyptian preposition m 'from'). Mizraim is merely m-Izra with the majestic plural ending 'im'. Likewise, that other great Semitic-speaking people -- the Assyrians -- called the country of the pharaohs 'Musri' (m-Usri)." [2]


Genesis 10 - The Table of Nations
http://www.enduringword.com/commentaries/0110.htm
The tenth chapter of Genesis . . . stands absolutely alone in ancient literature, without a remote parallel, even among the Greeks, where we find the closest approach to a distribution of peoples in genealogical framework . . . The Table of Nations remains an astonishing accurate document. (William F. Albright, cited in Boice)

A. The descendants of Japheth.

1. (1) The three sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

Now this is the genealogy of the sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth. And sons were born to them after the flood.

2. (2) The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

The sons of Japheth were Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

a. The sons of Japheth: He was the father of the Indo-European peoples, those stretching from India to the shores of Western Europe. They are each linked by linguistic similarities that often seem invisible to the layman but are much more obvious to the linguist.

b. Gomer: From this son of Japheth came the Germanic peoples, from whom came most of the original peoples of Western Europe. These include the original French, Spanish, and Celtic settlers.

c. Magog . . . Tubal, Meshech: These settled in the far north of Europe and became the Russian peoples.

d. Madai: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Medes and they populated what are now Iran and Iraq. The peoples of India also came from this branch of Japheth’s family.

e. Javan: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Greeks, whose sea-faring ways are described in Genesis 10:5.

3. (3) The sons of Gomer.

The sons of Gomer were Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah.

a. Ashkenaz: From this son of Gomer came the peoples who settled north of Judea into what we call the Fertile Crescent.

b. Togarmah: From this son of Gomer came the Armenians.

4. (4-5) The sons of Javan (the ancient Greeks).

The sons of Javan were Elishah, Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim. From these the coastland peoples of the Gentiles were separated into their lands, everyone according to his language, according to their families, into their nations.

a. The sons of Javan were: Geographic names that spring from these names in this chapter abound. Linguists have no trouble seeing the connection between Kittim and Cyprus, Rodanim and Rhodes, Gomer and Germany, Meschech and Moscow, Tubal and Tobolsk.

B. The descendants of Ham.

1. (6) The sons of Ham: Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

The sons of Ham were Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

a. Ham: The descendants of Ham are the peoples who populated Africa and the Far East.

b. Cush: Apparently, this family divided into two branches early. Some founded Babylon (notably, Nimrod) and others founded Ethiopia.

c. Mizraim: This is another way the Bible refers to Egypt. Put refers to Libya, the region of North Africa west of Egypt. Canaan refers to the peoples who originally settled the land we today think of as Israel and its surrounding regions.
2. (7-12) The sons of Cush.

The sons of Cush were Seba, Havilah, Sabtah, Raamah, and Sabtechah; and the sons of Raamah were Sheba and Dedan. Cush begot Nimrod; he began to be a mighty one on the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord; therefore it is said, “Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord.” And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, Erech, Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar. From that land he went to Assyria and built Nineveh, Rehoboth Ir, Calah, and Resen between Nineveh and Calah (that is the principal city).



a. Cush begot Nimrod: One son of Cush worthy of note is Nimrod. He was a mighty one on the earth, but not in a good way. He ruled over Babel, which was the first organized rebellion of humans against God. The name Nimrod itself means, “let us rebel.”



b. Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord: The context shows that this is not a compliment of Nimrod. The idea is that Nimrod was an offense before the face of God.



i. “This is not talking about Nimrod’s ability to hunt wild game. He was not a hunter of animals. He was a hunter of men - a warrior. It was through his ability to fight and kill and rule ruthlessly that his kingdom of the Euphrates valley city states was consolidated.” (Boice)



ii. A Jerusalem Targum says: “He was powerful in hunting and in wickedness before the Lord, for he was a hunter of the sons of men, and he said to them, ‘Depart from the judgment of the Lord, and adhere to the judgment of Nimrod!’ Therefore it is said: ‘As Nimrod the strong one, strong in hunting, and in wickedness before the Lord.’ ”



iii. Ginzberg quotes from a Jewish legend: “The great success that attended all of Nimrod’s undertakings produced a sinister effect. Men no longer trusted in God, but rather in their own prowess and ability, an attitude to which Nimrod tried to convert the whole world.”

iv. “Hence it is likely that Nimrod, having acquired power, used it in tyranny and oppression; and by rapine and violence founded the domination which was the first distinguished by the name of a kingdom on the face of the earth. How many kingdoms have been founded in the same way, in various ages and nations from that time to the present! From the Nimrods of the earth, God deliver the world!” (Clarke)

3. (13-14) The sons of Mizraim.

Mizraim begot Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, and Casluhim (from whom came the Philistines and Caphtorim).

4. (15-19) The sons of Canaan.

Canaan begot Sidon his firstborn, and Heth; the Jebusite, the Amorite, and the Girgashite; the Hivite, the Arkite, and the Sinite; the Arvadite, the Zemarite, and the Hamathite. Afterward the families of the Canaanites were dispersed. And the border of the Canaanites was from Sidon as you go toward Gerar, as far as Gaza; then as you go toward Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboiim, as far as Lasha.

a. Canaan begot Sidon: The family of Sidon, the son of Canaan, went north and is related to the Hittites and Lebanese.

b. And the Sinite: Many people believe the Oriental peoples descended from the Sinites.

5. (20) The spread of the descendants of Ham.

These were the sons of Ham, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands and in their nations.

C. The descendants of Shem.

1. (21-22) The sons of Shem: Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

And children were born also to Shem, the father of all the children of Eber, the brother of Japheth the elder. The sons of Shem were Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

a. Children were born also to Shem: From Shem comes Elam, who was an ancestor to the Persian peoples; Asshur, who was the father of the Assyrians; Lud was father to the Lydians who lived for a time in Asia Minor; and Aram was father to the Arameans, who we also know as the Syrians. Arphaxad was the ancestor to Abram and the Hebrews.

2. (23) The sons of Aram.

The sons of Aram were Uz, Hul, Gether, and Mash.

a. Uz: Later, a region in Arabia was named after this son of Aram.

Job came from the land of Uz (Job 1:1).

3. (24-30) The sons and descendants of Arphaxad.

Arphaxad begot Salah, and Salah begot Eber. To Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg, for in his days the earth was divided; and his brother’s name was Joktan. Joktan begot Almodad, Sheleph, Hazarmaveth, Jerah, Hadoram, Uzal, Diklah, Obal, Abimael, Sheba, Ophir, Havilah, and Jobab. All these were the sons of Joktan. And their dwelling place was from Mesha as you go toward Sephar, the mountain of the east.

a. All these were the sons of Joktan: The names under the son of Joktan (son of Eber, son of Salah, son of Arphaxad) are all associated with various Arabic peoples.

b. And Jobab: The one named Jobab may be the one we know as Job in the Old Testament.

4. (31) The spread of the descendants of Shem.

These were the sons of Shem, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands, according to their nations.
5. (32) Summary statement: the nations after the flood.

These were the families of the sons of Noah, according to their generations, in their nations; and from these the nations were divided on the earth after the flood.

a. “Hence one must consider this chapter of Genesis a mirror in which to discern that we human beings are, namely, creatures so marred by sin that we have no knowledge of our own origin, not even of God Himself, our Creator, unless the Word of God reveals these sparks of divine light to us from afar . . . This knowledge the Holy Scriptures reveal to us. Those who are without them live in error, uncertainty, and boundless ungodliness; for they have no knowledge about who they are and whence they came.” (Luther, cited in Boice)
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MIZRAIM = EGYPT

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You also deceive about the Replacement/Superssessionism Theology......This is Strike 3 and a few more to go. thumbs up

http://www.biblestudyproject.org/israel3.1-replacement-theology-messianic.htm

The Truth

We believe Israel is God's special people, distinct from the body of Messiah, chosen by Him to be a holy nation and a Kingdom of priests. The election of Israel is irrevocable. . . . We believe the Abrahamic Covenant is an irrevocable, unconditional covenant God made with Jewish people. This covenant provides title to the land of Israel for the Jewish people and promises a descendant (the Messiah) who would come to redeem Israel and bless the entire world. The spiritual blessings of the Abrahamic Covenant overflow to all the nations. God will ultimately fulfill every aspect of the covenant in the Messianic Kingdom, both physical and spiritual. . . .
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Your LIE!!!!!!!

A. SUPERSESSIONISM OR REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY

The meaning of this doctrine is that the church superseded or replaced Israel as God's covenant people. The three claims presented under this heading are:
1. God has rejected Israel,
2. the church has replaced Israel as God's covenant people, and
3. the church is therefore spiritual Israel.

If God has rejected Israel, then that clears the way for a replacement people; and if that people is the church, then the church may be considered spiritual Israel. It is also conceivable that some who believe that Israel is still God's covenant people would consider the church spiritual Israel because it is composed of people whose spirits have been regenerated by the Holy Spirit. We will now hold the light of Scripture to these claims and possibilities.
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Paul follows his emphatic response with, for I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. . . . What is his point? If God had rejected Israel as His covenant people, then every Israelite would be disqualified from the possibility of being saved; yet he is an Israelite who is saved, and that proves that God has not rejected His people.

To sum up, we have noticed two proofs that God has not rejected Israel as His covenant people:
1. By the very meaning of May it never be! in the way that Paul used it in different contexts.
2. By the fact that Paul was a saved Israelite.


Nevertheless, we'll address several passages that need clarification.

b. Romans 11:1-5

1. I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2. God has not rejected His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says in the passage about Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel? 3. "Lord, THEY HAVE KILLED YOUR PROPHETS, THEY HAVE TORN DOWN YOUR ALTARS, AND I ALONE AM LEFT, AND THEY ARE SEEKING MY LIFE." 4. But what is the divine response to him? "I HAVE KEPT for Myself SEVEN THOUSAND MEN WHO HAVE NOT BOWED THE KNEE TO BAAL." 5. In the same way then, there has also come to be at the present time a remnant according to God's gracious choice.



Replacement Theology

Its Origins, Teachings and Errors

By Dr. Gary Hedrick, President of CJF Ministries

(With Minor Editing By Rabbi Loren)

http://www.shema.com/Combating%20Replacement%20Theology/crt-004.php

http://www.therefinersfire.org/replacement_theology.htm

These are serious errors/deformations in your Theology and Worldview. What do you have to say for yourself. You gibber on and on about being persecuted yet you, yourself; are the persecuter. You lie about the Jews and their Sacred scriptures and you attempt to steal their identity and destiny, without being able to read/write Hebrew. Your ignorance and hubris is appalling Capiche? thumbs up


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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  sharky on Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:38 am

el kabong wrote:Zion/Zionism thumbs up

JESUS AND THE IDENTITY OF GOD

http://www.ntwrightpage.com/Wright_JIG.htm

Some theologies, e.g., ancient Epicureanism and modern Deism, believe in a god, or gods, but think they have nothing much to do with the world in which we live. Others, like Stoicism, believe that god, or “the divine,” or “the sacred” is simply a dimension of our world, so that “god” and the world end up being pretty much the same thing. Both of these can give birth to practical or theoretical atheism. The first can let its “god” get so far away that he disappears. This is what happened with Marx and Feuerbach in the nineteenth century, allowing the “absentee landlord” of eighteenth-century Deism to become simply an absentee. The second can get so used to various “gods” around the place that it ceases to care much about them. This is what happened with a good deal of ancient paganism in Greece and Rome, until, as Pliny wryly remarks, the arrival of Christianity stirred up pagans to a fresh devotion to their gods.[9]

The Jews believed in a quite different “god.” This god, YHWH, “the One Who Is,” the Sovereign One, was not simply the objectification of forces and drives within the world, but was the maker of all that exists. Several biblical books, or parts thereof, are devoted to exploring the difference between YHWH and the pagan idols: Daniel, Isaiah 40-55, and a good many Psalms spring obviously to mind. The theme is summed up in the Jewish daily prayer: “YHWH our God, YHWH is one!”[10]

Classic Jewish monotheism, then, believed that (a) there was one God, who created heaven and earth and who remained in close and dynamic relation with his creation; and that (b) this God had called Israel to be his special people. This twin belief, tested to the limit and beyond through Israel’s checkered career, was characteristically expressed through a particular narrative: the chosen people were also the rescued people, liberated from slavery in Egypt, marked out by the gift of Torah, established in their land, exiled because of disobedience, but promised a glorious return and final settlement. Jewish-style monotheism meant living in this story and trusting in this one true God, the God of creation and covenant, of Exodus and Return.

This God was utterly different from the pantheist’s “one god.” This is an important point to note: many, including many scholars, have blithely assumed that because Stoics and others talked about “one god” they were saying the same thing as the Jews. This God was also utterly different from the far-away ultra-transcendent gods of the Epicureans. Always active within his world, did he not feed the young ravens when they called upon him?[11]—he could be trusted to act more specifically on behalf of Israel. His eventual overthrow of pagan power at the political would be the revelation of his overthrow of the false gods of the nations. His vindication of his people, liberating them finally from all their oppressors, would also be the vindication of his own name and reputation. In justifying his people, he would himself be justified. In his righteousness, his covenant faithfulness, they would find their own.

This monotheism was never, in our period, an inner analysis of the being of the one God. It was always a way of saying, frequently at great risk: our God is the true God, and your gods are worthless idols. It was a way of holding on to hope. We can see the dynamic of this monotheism working its way out in the manifold crises of second-temple Judaism, with the Maccabees, Judas the Galilean, and above all the two wars of the late 60s and early 130s A.D. revealing how the creational and covenantal theology and worldview remained at work through the period and in different groups.

This God was both other than the world and continually active within it. The words “transcendent” and “immanent,” we should note, are pointers to this double belief, but do not clarify it much. Because this God is thus simultaneously other than his people and present with them, Jews of Jesus’ day had developed several ways of speaking about the activity of this God in which they attempted to hold together, because they dared not separate, these twin truths. Emboldened by deep-rooted traditions, they explored what appears to us a strange, swirling sense of a rhythm of mutual relations within the very being of the one God: a to-and-fro, a give-and-take, a command-and-obey, a sense of love poured out and love received. God’s Spirit broods over the waters, God’s Word goes forth to produce new life, God’s Law guides his people, God’s Presence or Glory dwells with them in fiery cloud, in tabernacle and temple. These four ways of speaking moved to and fro from metaphor to trembling reality-claim and back again. They enabled Jews to speak simultaneously of God’s sovereign supremacy and his intimate presence, of his unapproachable holiness and his self-giving compassionate love.

Best known of all is perhaps a fifth. God’s Wisdom is his handmaid in creation, the firstborn of his works, his chief of staff, his delight. God’s Wisdom is another way of talking about God present with his people in the checkered careers of the patriarchs and particularly in the events of the Exodus. Wisdom becomes closely aligned thereby with Torah and Shekinah.[12] Through the Lady Wisdom of Proverbs 1-8, the creator has fashioned everything, especially the human race. To embrace Wisdom is therefore to discover the secret of being truly human, of reflecting God’s image.[13]............................Out of all this, I have argued in various places that we can, as historians, properly reconstruct Jesus of Nazareth’s sense of vocation. We can study John the Baptist’s vocation, and Paul’s: why should we not study Jesus’? When we do so, we find that dozens and dozens of lines of inquiry converge to produce a well ordered, coherent, historically credible sense of vocation, emerging in central symbolic actions, hinted at in a hundred cryptic and teasing sayings. Jesus believed he was Israel’s Messiah, the one in whom Israel’s history was to be summed up. Jesus believed he would win the messianic victory over the real enemy and would build the true messianic temple through taking Israel’s fate upon himself and going to the cross. Jesus believed that in doing so he was not just pointing to or talking about, but was actually embodying, the return of YHWH to Zion. These, though striking and startling, emerge from the world of Second Temple Judaism like the flower growing suddenly out of the plant. They were not expected, but upon inspection this is where they belonged. All the elements of the package were around somewhere in the culture. They are not, repeat not, a retrojection of later Christian theology, not even of later NT theology, which by and large developed in other legitimate ways. They are only credible, but they are totally credible, as the historically reconstructed mindset of Jesus himself. And they form, not the substance of later atonement and incarnational theology, but its historical starting point.

...............................



I have argued elsewhere that a central feature of Jewish expectation, and kingdom expectation at that, in Jesus’ time was the hope that YHWH would return in person to Zion. Having abandoned Jerusalem at the time of the exile, his return was delayed, but he would come back at last. Within this context, someone who told cryptic stories about a king or a master who went away, left his servants with tasks to perform, and then returned to see how they were getting on must—not “might,” must point to this controlling, over-arching metanarrative. Of course, the later Church, forgetting the first century Jewish context, read such stories as though they were originally about Jesus himself going away and then returning in a “second coming.” Of course, cautious scholars noticing this, deny that Jesus would have said such things. I propose that here at the heart of Jesus’ work, and at the moment of its climax, Jesus not only told stories about the king, who came back to Zion to judge and to save. He acted as though he thought the stories were coming true in what he himself was accomplishing. This is the context, at last, in which I think it best to approach the question with which this essay began.........................................And Jesus seems to have believed it about himself. The language was deeply coded, but the symbolic action was not. He was coming to Zion, doing what YHWH had promised to do. He explained his action with riddles all pointing in the same direction. Recognize this, and you start to see it all over the place, especially in parables and actions whose other layers have preoccupied us. Why, after all, does Jesus tell a story about a yearning father in order to account for his own behavior?[36] It is this that also accounts for his sovereign attitude to Torah, his speaking on behalf of Wisdom, and his announcement of forgiveness of sins.[37] By themselves none of these would be conclusive. Even if they are allowed to stand as words and actions of Jesus, they remain cryptic. But predicate them of the same young man who is then on his way to Jerusalem to confront the powers that be with the message and the action of the kingdom of God and who tells stories as he does which are best interpreted as stories of YHWH returning to Zion, then you have reached. I believe, the deep heart of Jesus’ own sense of vocation. He believed himself called to do and be what in the scriptures only Israel’s God did and was.

..................................What are we therefore saying about the earthly Jesus? In Jesus himself, I suggest we see the biblical portrait of YHWH come to life: the loving God, rolling up his sleeves (Isa 52:10) to do in person the job that no one else could do, the creator God giving new life the God who works through his created world and supremely through his human creatures, the faithful God dwelling in the midst of his people, the stern and tender God relentlessly opposed to all that destroys or distorts the good creation, and especially human beings, but recklessly loving all those in need and distress. “He shall feed his flock like a shepherd; he shall carry the lambs in his arms; and gently lead those that are with young” (Isa 40:11). It is the OT portrait of YHWH, but it fits Jesus like a glove. ...............
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Apparently you don't know shit about 'ZION'.
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http://mashiyach.com/

The Kingdom of Elohim is represented by Tsiyon (pronounced Tsee-yone or Zion in English), a literal place in Jerusalem, that symbolizes a spiritual place, the seat of Mashiyach's government on this earth. Originally Zion was a small location in Jerusalem, then it became a code name for the whole city of Jerusalem.



For it is said in the Scripture, “Behold, in Tsiyon I lay a chosen and precious stone for the head of the corner; and whoever believes in him will not be ashamed.” On you therefore who believe is this honor conferred: but to them who do not believe “he is a stone of stumbling and a rock of offense.” And they stumble at it because they believe not the Word from where they were appointed. But you are an elect race, officiating as priests of the Kingdom; a Set Apart people, a redeemed congregation; that you should proclaim the praises of him who called you out of darkness to his precious light: who formerly were not counted as a people but now are the people of Elohim; and also, there were (once) no mercies on you but now mercies are poured out upon you. My beloved, I entreat you as strangers and pilgrims, separate yourselves from all lusts of the body, for they war against the soul. And let your behavior be honorable before all men; so that they who utter evil speeches against you, may see your good actions and may praise Elohim in the day of trial. And be submissive to all the sons of men, for Elohim’s sake; to kings, on account of their authority; and to judges because they are sent by him for the punishment of offenders, and for the praise of them that do well. For so is the will of Elohim, that by your good deeds you may stop the mouth of the foolish who do not know Elohim: As free men, you are not like men who make their freedom a cloak for their wickedness, but as the servants of Elohim. 1 Peter 2:6-16




Throughout Scripture we read of a Kingdom that is not of this earth, but it is shaped from the pattern that is in Heaven. The tabernacle in the wilderness was built according to the specifications that YHWH gave to Moses and within that tabernacle, each of the physical elements are symbols of the spiritual or heavenly Kingdom. It is also interesting to note that Zion is mentioned in 153 verses in the Tanakh... this is the same number of fish the disciples caught in John 21:11. The symbolism is clear, Yeshua taught his disciples how to build the Kingdom of Heaven, as opposed to a religion "about" the Kingdom of Heaven, a very big difference.



We are being trained to know what Tsiyon is, and what it is not. No religion or people's groups have exclusive rights to Tsiyon, it belongs to the people of Mashiyach regardless of religion, race, color or creed. The Government of Tsiyon is on the shoulder of Mashiyach. Mashiyach is returning to the Mount of Olives from whence he departed, but this time round Scripture tells us he will be Mashiyach Ben David a much different scenario than when he first came to earth.



There is the Israel of Elohim (spiritual) and there is the other kingdom of Israel of the flesh. Not all who are Israel of the flesh are the Israel of Elohim. If we can look at Jews, Christians or Muslims without judging them by their religion or race, then we are getting closer to ZION, as how it is revealed in Mashiyach. The Kingdom of Elohim is a government, NOT a religion.



Tsiyon is also the place in our neshama (spirit) where we connect with Mashiyach where our heart receives and gives love for all of Creation, where we can see all others through the eyes of Mashiyach and carry no prejudice towards anyone. The Kingdom is within us, it is not an external government or religion.


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You're claim that Israel is an insignificant strip of sand illuminates your ignorance. Israel is the Left/Western Arm of the fertile Crescent..........the Israelites have even made the southern desert areas bloom due to hard work, a foreign concept to you. thumbs up

http://www.zionism-israel.com/

What is Zionism?
Zionism is the political movement that is implementing the national liberation of the Jewish people. It is based on the assertion that the Jewish people, like any other people, has the right to self-determination; Jews have a right to a national home in their historic homeland. Zionism has made a reality of the "impossible" project of restoration of the Jewish people to our homeland, after nearly 2,000 years of exile. The work of Zionism is far from complete, however.

Zionism has always been a part of Judaism
The ideological and cultural foundations of Zionism have always been present in Jewish tradition. Jews always thought of themselves as a nation or people. The concept of "am Yisrael" - the "people of Israel" or "nation of Israel," has been inherent in Jewish culture from ancient times. Jewish cultural and religious life always centered around the land of Israel. This did not change during two millennia of dispersion.




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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  sharky on Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:47 am

barnacle bill wrote:
el kabong wrote: Zion/Zionism thumbs up

JESUS AND THE IDENTITY OF GOD

http://www.ntwrightpage.com/Wright_JIG.htm

Some theologies, e.g., ancient Epicureanism and modern Deism, believe in a god, or gods, but think they have nothing much to do with the world in which we live. Others, like Stoicism, believe that god, or “the divine,” or “the sacred” is simply a dimension of our world, so that “god” and the world end up being pretty much the same thing. Both of these can give birth to practical or theoretical atheism. The first can let its “god” get so far away that he disappears. This is what happened with Marx and Feuerbach in the nineteenth century, allowing the “absentee landlord” of eighteenth-century Deism to become simply an absentee. The second can get so used to various “gods” around the place that it ceases to care much about them. This is what happened with a good deal of ancient paganism in Greece and Rome, until, as Pliny wryly remarks, the arrival of Christianity stirred up pagans to a fresh devotion to their gods.[9]

The Jews believed in a quite different “god.” This god, YHWH, “the One Who Is,” the Sovereign One, was not simply the objectification of forces and drives within the world, but was the maker of all that exists. Several biblical books, or parts thereof, are devoted to exploring the difference between YHWH and the pagan idols: Daniel, Isaiah 40-55, and a good many Psalms spring obviously to mind. The theme is summed up in the Jewish daily prayer: “YHWH our God, YHWH is one!”[10]

Classic Jewish monotheism, then, believed that (a) there was one God, who created heaven and earth and who remained in close and dynamic relation with his creation; and that (b) this God had called Israel to be his special people. This twin belief, tested to the limit and beyond through Israel’s checkered career, was characteristically expressed through a particular narrative: the chosen people were also the rescued people, liberated from slavery in Egypt, marked out by the gift of Torah, established in their land, exiled because of disobedience, but promised a glorious return and final settlement. Jewish-style monotheism meant living in this story and trusting in this one true God, the God of creation and covenant, of Exodus and Return.

This God was utterly different from the pantheist’s “one god.” This is an important point to note: many, including many scholars, have blithely assumed that because Stoics and others talked about “one god” they were saying the same thing as the Jews. This God was also utterly different from the far-away ultra-transcendent gods of the Epicureans. Always active within his world, did he not feed the young ravens when they called upon him?[11]—he could be trusted to act more specifically on behalf of Israel. His eventual overthrow of pagan power at the political would be the revelation of his overthrow of the false gods of the nations. His vindication of his people, liberating them finally from all their oppressors, would also be the vindication of his own name and reputation. In justifying his people, he would himself be justified. In his righteousness, his covenant faithfulness, they would find their own.

This monotheism was never, in our period, an inner analysis of the being of the one God. It was always a way of saying, frequently at great risk: our God is the true God, and your gods are worthless idols. It was a way of holding on to hope. We can see the dynamic of this monotheism working its way out in the manifold crises of second-temple Judaism, with the Maccabees, Judas the Galilean, and above all the two wars of the late 60s and early 130s A.D. revealing how the creational and covenantal theology and worldview remained at work through the period and in different groups.

This God was both other than the world and continually active within it. The words “transcendent” and “immanent,” we should note, are pointers to this double belief, but do not clarify it much. Because this God is thus simultaneously other than his people and present with them, Jews of Jesus’ day had developed several ways of speaking about the activity of this God in which they attempted to hold together, because they dared not separate, these twin truths. Emboldened by deep-rooted traditions, they explored what appears to us a strange, swirling sense of a rhythm of mutual relations within the very being of the one God: a to-and-fro, a give-and-take, a command-and-obey, a sense of love poured out and love received. God’s Spirit broods over the waters, God’s Word goes forth to produce new life, God’s Law guides his people, God’s Presence or Glory dwells with them in fiery cloud, in tabernacle and temple. These four ways of speaking moved to and fro from metaphor to trembling reality-claim and back again. They enabled Jews to speak simultaneously of God’s sovereign supremacy and his intimate presence, of his unapproachable holiness and his self-giving compassionate love.

Best known of all is perhaps a fifth. God’s Wisdom is his handmaid in creation, the firstborn of his works, his chief of staff, his delight. God’s Wisdom is another way of talking about God present with his people in the checkered careers of the patriarchs and particularly in the events of the Exodus. Wisdom becomes closely aligned thereby with Torah and Shekinah.[12] Through the Lady Wisdom of Proverbs 1-8, the creator has fashioned everything, especially the human race. To embrace Wisdom is therefore to discover the secret of being truly human, of reflecting God’s image.[13]............................Out of all this, I have argued in various places that we can, as historians, properly reconstruct Jesus of Nazareth’s sense of vocation. We can study John the Baptist’s vocation, and Paul’s: why should we not study Jesus’? When we do so, we find that dozens and dozens of lines of inquiry converge to produce a well ordered, coherent, historically credible sense of vocation, emerging in central symbolic actions, hinted at in a hundred cryptic and teasing sayings. Jesus believed he was Israel’s Messiah, the one in whom Israel’s history was to be summed up. Jesus believed he would win the messianic victory over the real enemy and would build the true messianic temple through taking Israel’s fate upon himself and going to the cross. Jesus believed that in doing so he was not just pointing to or talking about, but was actually embodying, the return of YHWH to Zion. These, though striking and startling, emerge from the world of Second Temple Judaism like the flower growing suddenly out of the plant. They were not expected, but upon inspection this is where they belonged. All the elements of the package were around somewhere in the culture. They are not, repeat not, a retrojection of later Christian theology, not even of later NT theology, which by and large developed in other legitimate ways. They are only credible, but they are totally credible, as the historically reconstructed mindset of Jesus himself. And they form, not the substance of later atonement and incarnational theology, but its historical starting point.

...............................



I have argued elsewhere that a central feature of Jewish expectation, and kingdom expectation at that, in Jesus’ time was the hope that YHWH would return in person to Zion. Having abandoned Jerusalem at the time of the exile, his return was delayed, but he would come back at last. Within this context, someone who told cryptic stories about a king or a master who went away, left his servants with tasks to perform, and then returned to see how they were getting on must—not “might,” must point to this controlling, over-arching metanarrative. Of course, the later Church, forgetting the first century Jewish context, read such stories as though they were originally about Jesus himself going away and then returning in a “second coming.” Of course, cautious scholars noticing this, deny that Jesus would have said such things. I propose that here at the heart of Jesus’ work, and at the moment of its climax, Jesus not only told stories about the king, who came back to Zion to judge and to save. He acted as though he thought the stories were coming true in what he himself was accomplishing. This is the context, at last, in which I think it best to approach the question with which this essay began.........................................And Jesus seems to have believed it about himself. The language was deeply coded, but the symbolic action was not. He was coming to Zion, doing what YHWH had promised to do. He explained his action with riddles all pointing in the same direction. Recognize this, and you start to see it all over the place, especially in parables and actions whose other layers have preoccupied us. Why, after all, does Jesus tell a story about a yearning father in order to account for his own behavior?[36] It is this that also accounts for his sovereign attitude to Torah, his speaking on behalf of Wisdom, and his announcement of forgiveness of sins.[37] By themselves none of these would be conclusive. Even if they are allowed to stand as words and actions of Jesus, they remain cryptic. But predicate them of the same young man who is then on his way to Jerusalem to confront the powers that be with the message and the action of the kingdom of God and who tells stories as he does which are best interpreted as stories of YHWH returning to Zion, then you have reached. I believe, the deep heart of Jesus’ own sense of vocation. He believed himself called to do and be what in the scriptures only Israel’s God did and was.

..................................What are we therefore saying about the earthly Jesus? In Jesus himself, I suggest we see the biblical portrait of YHWH come to life: the loving God, rolling up his sleeves (Isa 52:10) to do in person the job that no one else could do, the creator God giving new life the God who works through his created world and supremely through his human creatures, the faithful God dwelling in the midst of his people, the stern and tender God relentlessly opposed to all that destroys or distorts the good creation, and especially human beings, but recklessly loving all those in need and distress. “He shall feed his flock like a shepherd; he shall carry the lambs in his arms; and gently lead those that are with young” (Isa 40:11). It is the OT portrait of YHWH, but it fits Jesus like a glove. ...............
.

Apparently you don't know shit about 'ZION'.
thumbs up

http://mashiyach.com/

The Kingdom of Elohim is represented by Tsiyon (pronounced Tsee-yone or Zion in English), a literal place in Jerusalem, that symbolizes a spiritual place, the seat of Mashiyach's government on this earth. Originally Zion was a small location in Jerusalem, then it became a code name for the whole city of Jerusalem.



For it is said in the Scripture, “Behold, in Tsiyon I lay a chosen and precious stone for the head of the corner; and whoever believes in him will not be ashamed.” On you therefore who believe is this honor conferred: but to them who do not believe “he is a stone of stumbling and a rock of offense.” And they stumble at it because they believe not the Word from where they were appointed. But you are an elect race, officiating as priests of the Kingdom; a Set Apart people, a redeemed congregation; that you should proclaim the praises of him who called you out of darkness to his precious light: who formerly were not counted as a people but now are the people of Elohim; and also, there were (once) no mercies on you but now mercies are poured out upon you. My beloved, I entreat you as strangers and pilgrims, separate yourselves from all lusts of the body, for they war against the soul. And let your behavior be honorable before all men; so that they who utter evil speeches against you, may see your good actions and may praise Elohim in the day of trial. And be submissive to all the sons of men, for Elohim’s sake; to kings, on account of their authority; and to judges because they are sent by him for the punishment of offenders, and for the praise of them that do well. For so is the will of Elohim, that by your good deeds you may stop the mouth of the foolish who do not know Elohim: As free men, you are not like men who make their freedom a cloak for their wickedness, but as the servants of Elohim. 1 Peter 2:6-16




Throughout Scripture we read of a Kingdom that is not of this earth, but it is shaped from the pattern that is in Heaven. The tabernacle in the wilderness was built according to the specifications that YHWH gave to Moses and within that tabernacle, each of the physical elements are symbols of the spiritual or heavenly Kingdom. It is also interesting to note that Zion is mentioned in 153 verses in the Tanakh... this is the same number of fish the disciples caught in John 21:11. The symbolism is clear, Yeshua taught his disciples how to build the Kingdom of Heaven, as opposed to a religion "about" the Kingdom of Heaven, a very big difference.



We are being trained to know what Tsiyon is, and what it is not. No religion or people's groups have exclusive rights to Tsiyon, it belongs to the people of Mashiyach regardless of religion, race, color or creed. The Government of Tsiyon is on the shoulder of Mashiyach. Mashiyach is returning to the Mount of Olives from whence he departed, but this time round Scripture tells us he will be Mashiyach Ben David a much different scenario than when he first came to earth.



There is the Israel of Elohim (spiritual) and there is the other kingdom of Israel of the flesh. Not all who are Israel of the flesh are the Israel of Elohim. If we can look at Jews, Christians or Muslims without judging them by their religion or race, then we are getting closer to ZION, as how it is revealed in Mashiyach. The Kingdom of Elohim is a government, NOT a religion.



Tsiyon is also the place in our neshama (spirit) where we connect with Mashiyach where our heart receives and gives love for all of Creation, where we can see all others through the eyes of Mashiyach and carry no prejudice towards anyone. The Kingdom is within us, it is not an external government or religion.


thumbs up

You're claim that Israel is an insignificant strip of sand illuminates your ignorance. Israel is the Left/Western Arm of the fertile Crescent..........the Israelites have even made the southern desert areas bloom due to hard work, a foreign concept to you. thumbs up

http://www.zionism-israel.com/

What is Zionism?
Zionism is the political movement that is implementing the national liberation of the Jewish people. It is based on the assertion that the Jewish people, like any other people, has the right to self-determination; Jews have a right to a national home in their historic homeland. Zionism has made a reality of the "impossible" project of restoration of the Jewish people to our homeland, after nearly 2,000 years of exile. The work of Zionism is far from complete, however.

Zionism has always been a part of Judaism
The ideological and cultural foundations of Zionism have always been present in Jewish tradition. Jews always thought of themselves as a nation or people. The concept of "am Yisrael" - the "people of Israel" or "nation of Israel," has been inherent in Jewish culture from ancient times. Jewish cultural and religious life always centered around the land of Israel. This did not change during two millennia of dispersion.




You're welcome in advance, thumbs up cheers wave


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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  true lilly on Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:22 pm

Scientists find two 'sunken islands' off WA -
part of Gondwana land link

by:Narelle Towie Science Reporter
From:PerthNow
November 14, 2011
9:19AM

17 comments



MYSTERIOUS: An image of one of the sunken islands. Source: PerthNow

SCIENTISTS have discovered two huge sunken islands in the Indian Ocean west of Perth.

The islands, about the size of Tasmania, were once part of the supercontinent Gondwana and are more than 1.5km underwater.

Researchers from the University of Sydney, Macquarie University and the University
of Tasmania say the islands were once above water and formed part of the last link
between India and Australia.

They made the discovery while mapping the seafloor of the Perth Abyssal Plain.

“The data collected on the voyage could significantly change our
understanding of the way in which India, Australia and Antarctica broke
off from Gondwana,” University of Sydney geologist Dr Joanne Whittaker
said.

The scientists returned to Perth last week after carrying
out the complicated task of dredging up hundreds of kilograms of rock
samples from the steep slopes of the two islands during a three-week
expedition aboard CSIRO vessel Southern Surveyor.

Related Coverage
We expected to see common oceanic rocks such as basalt in the
dredge, but were surprised to see continental rocks such as granite,
gneiss and sandstone containing fossils,”
University of Sydney’s chief
expedition scientist Dr Simon Williams said.

“A detailed analysis of the rocks dredged up during the voyage will tell us about
their age and how they fit into the Gondwana jigsaw.”

The islands, called ‘micro-continents’, were formed when India began to
move away from Australia, about 130 million years ago during the
Cretaceous period, when dinosaurs roamed the Earth.

They became stranded thousands of kilometres from either coast as the land masses separated, the scientists say.

“The sunken islands charted during the expedition have flat tops, which
indicates they were once at sea level before being gradually submerged,”
Dr Whittaker said.

“Our preliminary analysis of the magnetic data that we collected
could cause us to rethink the plate tectonic story for the whole of
the Eastern Indian Ocean,” she said.


(funny thing is, all I've asked of folk is to re-read what Holy Scripture
actually describes, in the revealing light breaking through where the
'dead wood' shaken from the 'accepted' myths of 'bible stories', shines
on the recent discoveries of science, that do support what God Described;
of both our truly ancient, and future, history.
While those who attack me for asking folk to think for themselves, keep
spamming 'me', with the long ago proven to fail, Religions of man, that
everywhere else on NET, they demand the world reject...FOR 'The New',
Ickest Type of Creator God Mocking, Global religion.
The 'funny' thing being, that 'they' believe others can't also see through
the desperation, to the motivation of 'their' floods of attacks.

Spirit LEVEL, water finds it's own LEVEL, sea LEVEL.
The land rises and sinks, and rises, out of the waters.
Just some of the basic science that used to be taught to primary school children,
but replaced by the Religious Preaching of Proudly Self Confessed Anti Christ Greenies, during this age, when science is discovering, what is actually described, in the full, contextual meaning of The Words of The Bible. Including that most ancient age of Life existing on earth Before oxygen(= prince of the air=rust/death) formed.

Remember also, God didn't ask for blind faith, but to search with our whole hearts
and minds and test scripture against what is real in this whole real world=diligently
do good science, in order to Know He exists, described All the world, All the earth and All peoples, From The Beginning, and Keeps All His Promises.

Like preserving a uniquely rich, geologically stable, land of unique light (due to it's unique position on the globe and it's angle to the sun), in the south, for the lost, scattered, mixed and mingled remnants of all the truly ancient tribes of Israel and their friends, to be re-gathered into, and from where, the healing of all the world begins.)

true lilly wrote:Earthquakes, Volcanoes...
...man and his MYTHS have
NEVER been able to SAVE anything...


...whereas, GOD TOLD US, HE CREATED LIFE,
and WITH HIM, ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE.


The Pompeii worm was found in the 1980s


Its family name Alvinellidae and genus name Alvinella
both derive from DSV Alvin, the three-person
submersible vehicle used during the discovery of
hydrothermal vents and their fauna
during the late 1970s.


Deep sea vents in the Atlantic Ocean’s Mid-Atlantic Ridge
support
tubeworms, eelpout fish, and crabs.
The Mid-Atlantic Ridge is an
underwater mountain chain
that extends about 10,000 miles (16,000
kilometers)
from the Arctic Ocean to the southern tip of Africa.
Water heated as high as 760°F (404°C)
by magma from Earth's interior
billows from a seafloor chimney.

http://environment.nationalgeographic.com/environment/habitats/deep-sea-vents/

Sadly, most don't use their access to the internet
for edifying education...and end up paying dearly,
trying to satisfy lusts and 'get rich', because they
didn't care to learn to Serve Just life...

dixie dean wrote:
09-11-2011, 12:18 AM #32097
Quote:
Originally Posted by stormrider73

I'm a "Targeted Individual" aka TI
You could reverse Targeted Individual to Individually Targeted which would give you IT.

When you put IT into Wiki you get three pages come up...

It (novel), It (film) and Information Technology

It might be worth keeping that in mind,

Last edited by dixie d; 09-11-2011 at 12:19 AM.
...and NO, you EVIL DICK "TINTIN", YOU DIDN'T 'predict' ANYTHING!

YOU PLOT, and PULL SOME OFF, but FRAZIER'S DEATH WAS EXPECTED,
AND WIDELY REPORTED IN THE MSN, BEFORE YOU, MORE (NOT less),
posted FISTS of YOUR EXCREMENTAL words, dates & images, TO LATER,
INSANELY EXPECT others to believe a CHERRY PICKED FEW, 'predicted'
SHIT!

But what EXPOSES YOU and YOUR OTHER 'names', IS THE LUST with
which YOU GLOAT and TRY TO PERSONALLY BOAST OF, DEATHS.
http://forum.davidicke.com/showthread.php?t=11956&page=3210
dixie dean wrote: 08-11-2011, 12:59 PM #32079
Quote:
Originally Posted by cori



JOE FRAZIER died
Frazier was diagnosed with liver cancer in late September 2011 and admitted to hospice care.[3] He died November 7, 2011.

November 7 is 117 or 711 reveresed. I also wondered if Smoking Joe might have any reference to Volcano

Quote:
Black smokers or deep sea vents are an example of this kind of volcanic activity.
Last edited by dixie d; 08-11-2011 at 01:00 PM.


true lilly wrote:30-10-2007, 04:33 PM #499
Quote:
Originally Posted by armoured saint

It's not like you have checked and
compared DNA samples of these as opposed to groups of people in the
middleast, egypt and south america as well as the Aborigines. So, how
did Moses get to Australia from south America and yet the source of the
story comes from either Egypt, middle or near east.

Don't tell me Noah built the 'Abel Tasman' and then handed it down to Moses somehow.

I like your font colouring. It dazzles the senses. Puts "King Of The Mountain" to shame.

And here we have it again folks, that DESPERATE NEED TO WORSHIP EGYPT,
The City of The DEATH CULT.

Now this 'character' is NOT unfamiliar with all that's been posted on this topic,
yet comes up with a childish, "Oh yeah!" post like this.

Now as for comparing DNA; it has been done and in the news, that native
Australians ARE THE OLDEST, PUREST Blooded peoples.
Related closest to the OLDEST PUREST SOUTH AMERICANS and Africans,
who in THEIR OWN ORAL HISTORY tell of NOT ORIGINATING in Africa.

So, AT LEAST 60,000 years of the LONGEST CONTINUOUS Cultures,
of the 'OLDEST' peoples, who's DREAMING STORIES ARE the Consistently
CLOSEST FITS TO GENESIS...but we'll just IGNORE ALL THAT and
"keep looking for" "where they came from"??!!!

The CLOSEST RELATED FLORA & FAUNA to OZ NATIVES, are South American.

'Jerusalem' wasn't GIVEN that name until around 1000 Year AFTER
Alexander The Great DELUDED PUPPET of his Twisted Mother, told
the world an ORACLE in EGYPT "told him" that "HE WAS THE SON of 'god'".

That's a THOUSAND YEARS of the MOST POWERFUL, ANTI-CHRIST
EMPIRES FORCING their 'history' down the throats of powerless,
uneducated peoples, with things like the CONTINUED BLOODY INQUISITIONS
that SLAUGHTERED, PRIMARILY, CHRISTIANS who would NOT accept ROME'S
COUNTERFEIT.

But "THEY" want YOU to IGNORE that Holy Scripture ALSO DESCRIBES
the NATURAL HISTORY that Science is finally catching up with; IGNORE
that Holy Scripture DESCRIBES the WHOLE World,
FROM THE TIME of The Super-Continent before that River Head became a SEA,
that "They", without foundation, RE-named the Euphrates.

In fact IGNORE ALL Holy Scripture, according to "Them" it's all a fairy tale,
EXCEPT THE BITS KNOWN TO BE CHANGED, in order TO SELL EGYPT'S
DEATH WORSHIP CULT!

Now long after Joshua died, after winning wars ON FOOT against Mounted
Armies and HAMSTRINGING all their BEASTS OF BURDEN (which is what those
'horses' and 'camels' are), they FORGOT Their God and History and were
DRIVEN OUT OF ZION (which included the UTTER DEVASTATION of the land
that The Creator also Promised He would cause to BLOOM RICH again when
the Lost, Scattered, Mixed and Mingled Israel, started returning), which
was when those Old Cultures of Asia took off, and the GENETIC MIX of
peoples across the world and into NORTHERN Europe SUPPORTS this.

And so does what VERY LITTLE Archeology had been done in this land;
a Large Corralling of Different, Large, Unknown DOMESTIC Animals.

But be patient, we'd need over 500 of these pages to catch up on all the
evidences for this case, that "this poster" KNOWS we've covered elsewhere.

It's the COUNTERFEITING "Jesuit Trained" scholars and "those who
say they are Jews but are NOT", who INVENTED that ONLY around 6000 year age
of the world according to ROMES 'bible'.

Holy Scripture DESCRIBES a MUCH OLDER AGE,
RIGHT BACK TO BEFORE MAN LIVED ON THE SUPER-CONTINENT.
true lilly wrote:Re: Aboriginal Stonehenge:
Stargazing in ancient Australia
true lilly Today, 9-11-2011 at 12:53 am
Geology
Prehistory of Antarctica



Map showing details of Gondwana break-up, including glacial scouring
as Australia moved northwards.
(Map: R Beaman)


Like all other continents, Antarctica has at its core an ancient
shield. The rocks of the East Antarctica shield are as old as 4 billion
years, which means that they are amongst the oldest known rocks on
Earth. Geologists are now studying this shield to help them gain insight
into the early geological processes of the Earth’s history.


In many ways, the evolution of Antarctica appears to be similar to
that of Australia.
The fossil record of the two continents is similar,
and Antarctica has yielded dinosaurs, amphibians and even marsupials
from ages when the continents were joined.


The position of the continents shifts constantly and the geography of
today's world is vastly different from what it was even a hundred
million years ago. Twenty million years before the dinosaurs became
extinct, Australia, Antarctica and South America were part of the same
land mass called Gondwana. In those days Antarctica was not covered in
ice, even though it was at the South Pole. Animals passed freely from
South America through Antarctica to Australia, and the plant species of
Gondwana were also closely related to each other.


Eighty five million years ago Australia began to separate from Antarctica.
The separation started slowly at first at a rate of only a few millimetres a year.
This then accelerated to the present rate of 7 cm a year.
Australia completely separated from Antarctica about 30 million years ago.


Scientists in Antarctica have discovered fossilised spores and pollen
of sundews, Nothofagus (which includes the Tasmanian myrtle
N. cunninghamii and the Tasmanian deciduous beech N. gunnii ).
The Tasmanian tree fern and creeping pine, are derived from forms which
once inhabited Australia and Antarctica.

Scientists were recently excited by a fossil discovery of twigs, roots, leaves
and pollen in Antarctica, of a form which is virtually indistinguishable
from Nothofagus gunnii , the Tasmanian deciduous beech.

These fossils may be ‘only’ 3 million years old.

This implies that Antarctica was not entirely covered by ice at that time.
Previous to this find, scientists had thought that Antarctica cooled and
became ice bound after Australia and South America separated
30 million years ago, allowing the Circumpolar Current to develop.
Scientists are still debating the age and significance of this
fossil discovery.


Antarctica without its ice

Casey: the Daintree of Antarctica

People who consider Antarctica to be a small continent will be
surprised to discover that it is larger than Europe and nearly twice the
size of Australia. The Antarctic continent, excluding its ice shelves,
covers over 13 million square kilometres compared with 7.7 million km²
for Australia, or 10.5 million km² for Europe. The map below gives some
idea of relative size.




Ninety-nine percent of Antarctica has a permanent blanket of snow and ice.
Only about one percent of the continent's rock base is visible
where it pokes through the ice sheet in the form of coastal outcrops,
mountain ranges or ‘nunataks’ which are isolated peaks.


The Transantarctic Mountains divide the continent into two
contrasting parts, the East and West. The Transantarctic Mountains
constitute one of the world’s longest and most impressive mountain
chains. They extend from the north western corner of the Ross Sea to the
south western corner of the Weddell Sea. West Antarctica, which
includes the Antarctic Peninsula, is smaller and has a complex
geological history. West Antarctica consists of four land units each
with a different history. There has been major volcanic activity here in
recent geological times and there are still a few active volcanic
centres.
Deep waters exist between land units and the West Antarctic ice
sheet, which can be considered to a be floating ice mass, held in place
by land peaks. West Antarctica includes the Vinson Massif, which has
the highest peak in Antarctica at 5140 metres.


Most of East Antarctica is still not well known by geologists but it
does include the Transantarctic Mountains.
These commonly exceed 4000
metres elevation. The shield is very depressed in the centre, where it
carries the bulk of the Antarctic ice sheet. Large areas lie deeper than
1000 metres below sea level.


Mining Antarctica

There are deposits of minerals such as coal and iron ore, but there
are vast economic and technical difficulties associated with the
recovery of mineral deposits. The Antarctic ice cover is, on average,
2.5 km thick and this means that very little of the land is accessible
for exploration, so work would have to take place under the ice sheet.
The difficult Antarctic conditions, evenwhen the technology works well
elsewhere make exploitation unlikely.
Once minerals are mined, Antarctica is a long way from world markets,
and material would have to be transported over the treacherous Southern
Ocean. Cheaper sources exist elsewhere in the world, and these will be
exploited before Antarctic sources.


So far, the economics of extracting resources from the harsh
Antarctic environment have prevented any commercial operations, but
Antarctica's climate may not protect its minerals indefinitely. What can
prevent such exploitation is a strong, well-supported international
agreement. Nations of the Antarctic Treaty System agreed in 1991 to put a
halt to the exploitation of minerals when they signed a comprehensive
Protocol on Environmental Protection (the Madrid Protocol), which banned
mining in Antarctica indefinitely. This important agreement came into
force in January 1998.

Read more about mining in Antarctica


Glossopteris (Fossil) leaf Permian age, Prince Charles Mountains.
(Photo: R Oldfield; Cat: 4766C1)


Antarctic prehistory facts
http://www.antarctica.gov.au/about-antarctica/fact-files/geology/antarctic-prehistory-facts

One more time, FROM THE BEGINNING...

Lebanon = "whiteness"
1) a wooded mountain range on the northern border of Israel

LEBANON

http://www.blueletterbible.org/search/translationResults.cfm?Criteria=lebanon&t=KJV

Every place 4725 whereon the soles 3709 of your feet 7272 shall tread 1869
shall be yours: from the wilderness 4057 and Lebanon 3844,
from the river 5104, the river 5104 Euphrates 6578,
even unto the uttermost 314 sea 3220 shall your coast 1366 be.


LABAN

http://www.blueletterbible.org/search/translationResults.cfm?Criteria=laban&t=KJV&sf=5

And Isaac 3327 sent away 7971 Jacob 3290:
and he went 3212 to Padanaram 6307 unto Laban 3837,
son 1121 of Bethuel 1328 the Syrian 761, the brother 251 of Rebekah 7259,
Jacob's 3290 and Esau's 6215 mother 517.

I left school at 14, not that I went much before then, as by 8, I knew
there was something about The Time Line, we weren't being taught, and
that, 'That Something' had to do with GOD.
Not that I left EDUCATION, I was doing my Horsemasters Diploma by 13,
and continued self education, all my life, taking interest in whatever any expert
on anything had to share.

Seekwith your whole heart and whole mind. That's what I set out to do,
and not so much 'despite', but 'because' of the many false paths I'd cross
and take, I discovered that faith, inThe Creator and The Truth of His Word,
was the only thing that led me past knowledge, to understanding,
and discovery, of yet more knowledge and understanding.

As I came to understand that just as Australia was 'presented' to be a
land of 'no historic value', my lack of deep interest in the deep sea
and Antarctica, was born of how they were 'presented'.

But my most deep interest was always in seeking to know God, which again,
led me to 'KNOW', what I'm still only discovering, others have long known...and
I should not keep having to argue the facts of.

God Exists!
God Described All The World, All The Earth and All Peoples,
From The Beginning.

And, God Does KEEP ALL HIS PROMISES.

P.S. and all the CRAP "Ciggy & Co.=Team TINTIN" keep,
REPEAT, REPEAT, REPEATING, "They" KNOW I've been
SHOWING TO BE "Their" DELIBERATE DECEPTIVE DISTRACTION,
since back in 2005, when I first went on line, and started being
BANNED from further expounding, and being LITERALLY, PHYSICALLY,
FINANCIALLY and Socially ATTACKED, BY "Them", Again.
As I always have been, when I refuse to blame God, for "THEIR" EVILS.


But see, when others of the hippy era, were PREACHING, "God doesn't exist",
I kept looking for His Promised Revealing Proofs, that He Creates AND SAVES
LIFE...and kept finding more and more...


PINK HAIRY SQUAT LOBSTER (Lauriea siagiani) - ©Scott Penny

They are not lobsters at all, but are more closely related to
porcelain crabs, hermit crabs and then, more distantly, true crabs.
They are distributed worldwide in the oceans, and occur from near the
surface to deep sea hydrothermal vents.

There are currently 870 described species.

They live on Giant Barrel Sponges. These squat lobsters are
remarkably colored, with their intense pink body, purple spots, and
bright yellow hairs that protrude in all directions.

Fossil squat lobsters have been found in strata
dating back to the Middle Jurassic of Europe.


Fact Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squat_lobster
http://www.thefeaturedcreature.com/#axzz1GGJ7mEM7

Deep-Sea Volcanoes
Don't Just Produce Lava Flows,
They Also Explode

ScienceDaily (Mar. 28, 2011)


http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/03/110328151734.htm
...and if you insist on believing that THE RELIGIONS PREACHED
by ANTI-LIFE GREENIE God Mockers can 'save you', KNOW that
GOD ALSO WARNED that WILLINGLY BLIND FAITH in MAN'S LIES,
CAN'T 'save'!
BUT GOD CAN and DOES, CREATE LIFE FROM NOTHING,
and RESURRECTS The 'dead' WHO DIDN'T DENY,
HIS HOLY SPIRIT of TRUTH.
Jeremiah 3:
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Jer&c=3&v=1&t=KJV#1
In those days 3117 the house 1004 of Judah 3063
shall walk 3212 with the house 1004 of Israel 3478,
and they shall come 935 together 3162
out of the land 776 of the north 6828
to the land 776 that I have given
for an inheritance 5157 unto your fathers 1.
But I said 559 , How shall I put 7896 thee
among the children 1121, and give 5414 thee
a pleasant 2532 land 776, a goodly 6643 heritage 5159

of the hosts 6635 of nations 1471?
and I said 559 , Thou shalt call 7121 me, My father 1;
and shalt not turn away 7725 from me 310.
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true lilly

Posts : 6205
Join date : 2010-01-02
Age : 56
Location : VICTORIA, AUSTRALIA

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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  sharky on Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:15 pm

true lilly wrote:
true lilly wrote:

I hate joooz, the Torah and Israel.........

rolling pin I vill take the joooooz holy scripture and deform it to fit my antisemitc/anti Israel agenda.........sieg hiel!!!!!! rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin rolling pin



sheeesh suzi/lilly, tell us sumthin' we don't know. You're a liar. thumbs up

http://press.princeton.edu/titles/8820.html

http://press.princeton.edu/chapters/i8820.pdf

Theology and Race

AT NOON ON SATURDAY, MAY 6, 1939, a group of Protestant theologians, pastors,
and churchgoers gathered at the historic Wartburg Castle, resonant with Lutheran
and nationalist significance, to celebrate the official opening of the Institute
for the Study and Eradication of Jewish Influence on German Church
Life (Institut zur Erforschung und Beseitigung des jüdischen Einfl usses auf
das deutsche kirchliche Leben). The Institute’s goals were both political and
theological. Seeking to create a dejudaized church for a Germany that was in
the process of ridding Europe of all Jews, it developed new biblical interpretations
and liturgical materials. In the six years of its existence, as the Nazi regime
carried out its genocide of the Jews, the Institute redefi ned Christianity
as a Germanic religion whose founder, Jesus, was no Jew but rather had fought
valiantly to destroy Judaism, falling as victim to that struggle. Germans were
now called upon to be the victors in Jesus’s own struggle against the Jews, who
were said to be seeking Germany’s destruction.


Most members of the Institute, particularly its academic director, Walter
Grundmann, professor of New Testament at the University of Jena, regarded
their work as being in the theological avant-garde, addressing and resolving
a problem that had long plagued Christian theology: how to establish clear and distinct boundaries between earliest Christianity and Judaism and eliminate all traces of Jewish influence from contemporary Christian theology and religious practice. As a predominantly younger generation of scholars, trained by Germany’s leading scholars of early Christianity—many members of the Institute were students of the distinguished Tübingen professor, Gerhard Kittel, himself a Nazi who produced antisemitic propaganda1—they saw themselves able to recover the historically genuine, non-Jewish Jesus and a Christian message compatible with contemporary German identity. Theirs was a goal of purification, authenticity, and theological revolution, all in the name of historical-critical methods and commitment to Germanness, to be achieved by eradicating the Jewish from the Christian. A Christian message tainted by Jewishness could not serve Germans, nor could a Jewish message be the accurate teaching of Jesus.
The Institute’s goals were stated forthrightly at its opening by Grundmann, who delivered the keynote lecture on “The Dejudaization of the Religious Life as the Task of German Theology and Church.” The present era, he declared, was similar to the Reformation: Protestants had to overcome Judaism just as Luther had overcome Catholicism. “The elimination of Jewish infl uence on German life is the urgent and fundamental question of the present German religious situation.”


Modern New Testament scholarship had made apparent the “deformation of New Testament ideas into Old Testament preconceptions, so that now angry recognition of the Jewishness in the Old Testament and in parts of the New Testament has arisen, obstructing access to the Bible for innumerable German people.”2
The Bible would have to be purified, Grundmann continued, restored to its pristine condition, to proclaim the truth about Jesus: that he sought the destruction of Judaism.


Munich’s Cardinal Faulhaber, for example, delivered a series of Advent sermons in 1933 attacking the German Christian movement, but his argument, almost identical to what the Confessing Church leaders came to argue, was that the Old Testament need not be eliminated as a Jewish book, as some German Christians advocated; it was, rather, an anti-Jewish book, Faulhaber insisted, since the prophets were constantly condemning Israel for its sinful ways.7 Faulhaber’s objection, then, was not to the German Christians’ antisemitism, but to their failure to realize that the Old Testament itself was on their side.8

ANTISEMITISM AND CHRISTIANITY
Hitler did not achieve most of his political and military goals, but on the Jewish question he succeeded remarkably. If his antisemitic propaganda found resonance, its success can be credited in large measure to the unrelenting
anti-Jewish Christian theological discourse that linked Nazi propaganda with the traditions and moral authority of the churches. That link was proclaimed with enthusiasm by Nazi Christians: “In the Nazi treatment of the Jews and its ideological stance, Luther’s intentions, after centuries, are being fulfi lled.”13 Antisemitism was the lingua franca of the Nazi era and was employed by church leaders to gain credibility with their own adherents—but also out of sincere antisemitic conviction. Antisemitism was also a tactic in the rhetorical battles among the different Christian factions, with each accusing its opponents of being “Jewish” while positioning itself as the true Nazi believer.14


In reality Nazism accomplished but few of its goals. But in one area, that of the Jewish question, political myth achieved its purpose to the full. Here the regime met the least opposition from those who in other matters were hardly in accord with Nazism—be it intellectuals, the churches or public opinion in the Reich or abroad. The Jew served as the focal point round which Nazism turned and on which the structural process of value-transformation and reversal of meanings took place. Among the values and meanings that were transformed, the symbol itself was turned into substance; consequently, the negation of Judaism had to be transformed into the annihilation of the Jew, this time not spiritually but rather physically, not symbolically but in substance.” Hitler made use of images of messianism, redemption,

and other Christian motifs, the most useful and consistent aspect of Christianity for the Nazi movement was its anti-Judaism, just as the single most consistent and persistent feature of Nazism was its antisemitism.
Hitler was well aware of arguments that were central to the Institute: that Jesus was an Aryan, and that Paul, as a Jew, had falsified Jesus’s message, themes he repeatedly mentioned in private conversations, together with rants against the church as a Jewish subversion of the Aryan spirit (though the reliability of his reported private conversations is uncertain). In a diatribe alleged to have occurred in October of 1941, the month Hitler made the decision to murder the Jews,17 Hitler proclaimed that Jesus was not a Jew, but a fi ghter against Jewry whose message was falsified and exploited by Paul: “St. Paul transformed a local movement of Aryan opposition to Jewry into a super-temporal religion, which postulates the equality of all men . . . [causing] the death of the Roman Empire.”18 His views demonstrate that the German Christian diagnosis of Christianity as tainted by Jewish influence resonated at the highest levels of the Reich, but that its prescribed solution of dejudaization was met with skepticism if not sheer mockery. Was Christianity thoroughly impregnated with Judaism, or could it be dejudaized, as the Institute claimed?
Like the antisemitic parties of the nineteenth century, the Nazi Party could not reject Christianity—not only because it would offend the moral and social sensibilities of Germans, but because the antisemitism of Christianity formed the basis on which the party could appeal to Germans with its racial and nationalist ideology. Nazism’s relationship to Christianity was not one of rejection, nor was it an effort to displace Christianity and become a form of “political religion.” Nazism did not present racial antisemitism as antithetical to Christian theological anti-Judaism; rather, Nazi ideology was a form of supersessionism, a usurpation and colonization of Christian theology, especially its antisemitism, for its own purposes. The theology of the Institute was a similar effort at supersessionism in reverse, taking over elements of Nazi racial ideology to bolster and redefine the Christian message. The result was an uneasy competition between two sides seeking popular support and institutional control, though access to power was, of course, highly asymmetrical.
Thus, while seeking to undermine the political power and moral authority of the churches, Nazism simultaneously appropriated key elements of Christian theology into its own ideology both for purposes of winning adherents used to Christian arguments and also to give its own message a coherence and resonance with the age-old Christian teachings that had shaped European
culture. Conversely, German Christians appropriated Nazi rhetoric and symbols into the church to give its Christianity a contemporary resonance. Both the Nazis and the German Christians identified Hitler as Christ’s second coming. That gave Hitler the status of a supernatural being and gave Christ renewed glory as a contemporary figure of enormous political signifi cance. Both were suspicious of the institutional church. Factions within the Nazi Reich and the party saw the church as competition and a potential threat to be ultimately eliminated after the war.19
..........................


The error Of Replacement Theology

http://www.therefinersfire.org/replacement_theology.htm

Replacement Theology was introduced to the Church shortly after Gentile leadership took over from Jewish leadership. What are its premises?

Israel (the Jewish people and the land) has been replaced by the Christian Church in the purposes of God, or, more precisely, the Church is the historic continuation of Israel to the exclusion of the former.


The Jewish people are now no longer a "chosen people." In fact, they are no different from any other group, such as the English, Spanish, or Africans.


Apart from repentance, the new birth, and incorporation into the Church, the Jewish people have no future, no hope, and no calling in the plan of God. The same is true for every other nation and group.


Since Pentecost of Acts 2, the term "Israel," as found in the Bible, now refers to the Church.


The promises, covenants and blessings ascribed to Israel in the Bible have been taken away from the Jews and given to the Church, which has superseded them. However, the Jews are subject to the curses found in the Bible, as a result of their rejection of Christ.

Replacement Theology

Its Origins, Teachings and Errors

By Dr. Gary Hedrick, President of CJF Ministries

(With Minor Editing By Rabbi Loren)


http://www.shema.com/Combating%20Replacement%20Theology/crt-004.php

Definition

Replacement Theology - reduced to its simplest form - teaches that the Church has replaced Israel in God’s plan. The term “Replacement Theology” is relatively new and unfamiliar to many people (in some cases, even those who believe in it). Among theologians, the older and more widely used term is “supersessionism.” The Church “supersedes” Israel. Its proponents teach that God has set aside Israel and made the Church “new Israel,” the new and improved people of God. There are many variations within the broad spectrum of Replacement Theology, but two of the main approaches are these:

1. Israel’s role as the people of God was completed (economic supersessionism). This is the kinder and gentler way of stating the basic thesis of Replacement Theology. It says that once the Messiah came 2,000 years ago, Israel’s mission was completed. A transition occurred at that point, and the Church took over as the people of God and became the focal point for the outworking of God’s plan and purpose in redemption. God is no longer working administratively through ethnic Israel.

2. Israel’s place as the people of God was forfeited (punitive supersessionism). Other Replacement theologians are more straightforward and actually say that the supposed replacement of Israel was a divine judgment on the nation for its rejection of the Messiah in the first century. This is what some writers have called “punitive secessionism.”

Perhaps Martin Luther articulated this position most eloquently when he wrote: “For such ruthless wrath of God is sufficient evidence that they [i.e., the Jewish people] assuredly have erred and gone astray. Even a child can comprehend this. For one dare not regard God as so cruel that he would punish his own people so long, so terrible, so unmercifully … Therefore this work of wrath is proof that the Jews, surely rejected by God, are no longer his people, and neither is he any longer their God” (“On the Jews and Their Lies,” Trans. Martin H. Bertram, in Luther’s Works [Philadelphia: Fortress Press, 1971], p. 265).

Common threads that weave their way through the numerous variations of supersessionism are (1) that God is finished with Israel as a nation, and (2) that the promises He made to Israel in the Old Testament have been inherited by the Church. (However, most Replacement theologians are reluctant to say that the Church - which is largely in apostasy today - has also inherited the curses and judgments that God pronounced on Israel for her apostasy.)

One defender of Replacement Theology writes: “The Jewish nation no longer has a place as the special people of God; that place has been taken by the Christian community which fulfills God’s purpose for Israel” (Bruce Waltke, “Kingdom Promises as Spiritual,” in Continuity and Discontinuity: Perspectives on the Relationship Between the Testaments, Ed. John S. Feinberg [Wheaton, Illinois: Crossway, 1987] p. 275). This is how one evangelical theologian summarized the essence of supersessionism in a paper he presented at the Evangelical Theological Society annual meeting a few years ago: “The issue is whether national Israel as an administrative structure is still in the plan of God” (“A Future for Israel in Covenant Theology: The Untold Story” by R. Todd Mangum, Instructor in Historical and Systematic Theology at Biblical Theological Seminary in Hatfield, Pennsylvania [November 16, 2000], p. 20.


THE END TIME SOLUTION TO
REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY!
By Rabbi/Brother Moshe Yoseph Koniuchowsky


http://yourarmstoisrael.org/Articles_new/restoration/?page=3&type=12

The hideous falsehood known as replacement theology has been a cancer in theological circles for the past two millennia that just seems to refuse to go away. While replacement theology takes on different applications, and modes, it is a theology originated by the early non Jewish fathers of the so called "Christian Church". It coldly states that a new Rome centered, and Roman based ecclesiastical organization called "the church", is the "new Israel". This new Israel, would now forever replace Jewish Israel, since Yahuwah permanently rejected the Jews for killing their Messiah, His Son. Extreme proponents of replacement theology have even gone so far as to claim that Yahuwah, the mean, and cruel despot, was the Elohim of the Old Covenant Jews, as opposed to Yahshua who is the forever loving, kind, and compassionate Elohim who had REPLACED YAHUWAH AS LORD OF "THE CHURCH" OR THE SO CALLED "NEW ISRAEL". In other words, Yahshua’s people have replaced the Father’s people.

This hideous doctrine is by no means a small theological side issue to be argued in a local pub. It has been at the forefront of antisemitism, Judeo-phobia, and has fully provided fuel for tragic historical events such as the Spanish Inquisition, the Catholic Crusades, the ouster of the Jews from every European country, as well as the Nazi holocaust. As history clearly demonstrates, Martin Luther, and other Protestant reformers blueprinted both the call, and the plans for the annihilation of the Jewish nation from Europe, and later the world by providing "so called Christians", with biblical justification to perpetrate genocide on world Jewry. Adolph Hitler knew full well that he could find theological approval, and support from these church folks. The inbred functionalism of this spiritual cancer amongst those that preach Yahshua is so widespread that it cannot be fully reversed, and eliminated until Yahshua’s millennial reign begins shortly when He returns to the earth. Even such seemingly benign church doctrines such as "Kingdom Now" theology or "Dominion" theology, where the so called "church" will christianize the world through the establishment of the bible as a global constitution, and whereby all world powers, and authorities will be won to, and taken over by Christendom, are nothing more than new attempts at replacing the "troublesome Jews". Wasn’t this flawed global christianization program, whereby Yahshua would merely take over a globally loyal populace converted through church efforts, already tried numerous times? Historically they were called the Crusades, Inquisitions, and Pogroms. Was it not the Crusaders who were attempting to take the globe by the sword, and convert, and subdue it by the gospel?

The theology of "Dominion Now" or "Kingdom Now", is nothing but a papal farce, designed to enlist Protestants in a new age attempt to liquidate the Jewish race, by theology rather than by a sword. They believe twentieth century man will not respond favorably to any elimination of the Jewish nation via bloodletting. Therefore in these last days, we see a major resurgence in "church" theology, designed to subdue, and eliminate the Jew. In these various applications of replacement theology, the Jew has no future whatsoever unless he agrees to become one with "the church", and assimilate his precious customs, feasts, seventh day Sabbaths, and the rest of his national identity through incorporation or more accurately through disappearance, and integration within "the church".

These hideous theologies call anything Jewish to be anti Christ, and legalistic. Jewish practices are not welcome in their church systems. It is simply fascinating to me that "the church" has this insatiable desire to institute biblical law, and church sovereignty over the globe by spreading Yahuwah’s laws, when one of the major errors within Christianity is the very rejection, and the denial of the validity of first covenant instruction in New Covenant times.

The so called "church" system has repeatedly, and pridefully proclaimed to its adherents that the Torah or the laws of first covenant Israel are passed away, and nailed to the cross, and have therefore been replaced by the second covenant law, which is love, baby, love. In other words, this man made ecclesiastical organization started, funded, and headquartered in Rome, now wants to force their paganized Christendom down the throats of the worlds populace, with obedience to THE TEN COMMANDMENTS, and other teachings all based on the Decalogue, all the while instructing her very own members that it is not applicable to the New Covenant "church". Now you talk about confusion! How can a man made ecclesiastical system that is boastfully, and wrongfully antinomian (anti-Torah), at it’s very core theology, force the world’s populace to submit to rules, and regulations that they themselves loath as having preceded from the Jewish despot named Yahuwah, and His Jews? Remember that in true replacement theology a pagan blonde haired, and blue eyed European, pork eating Jesus (the English translation of the sun deity Zeus), has replaced Yahuwah the Father as LORD (from the pagan deity Lourdes), over his "church" (from the pagan circular ritual conducted by the Celts).

The most disturbing part of all this is that replacement theology continues to spread overtly, and covertly in these last days seemingly unchecked, and undetected by born again folks of all denominations, as well as by Messianic Jews. As this study progresses you will find, and discover the alarming fact that modern day Messianic Judaism has in most cases fallen into the same trap of replacement theology that they loath, and despise. Messianic Judaism has every right to loath replacement theology. However through error, and pride they not only forsake the true solution to the error of replacement theology, (which is readily available by studying the scriptures accurately with an open mind), but worse yet, they have unknowingly become accomplices to the doctrine itself.

Before we demonstrate the biblically prescribed means for the elimination of this hideous creed, we will learn a few more insights into this doctrine of replacement theology. The first error of this false doctrine is that the church has replaced Israel (the Jews) as the historic continuation of the people of Israel. According to this line of reasoning, Jewish Israel ceased from being a people, with a historic relevancy to Yahuwah at Pentecost in 33 AD. In other words, a total cessation of all eternal promises, and blessings which had been promised to the Jews, had come about because of the New Covenant "church", who unilaterally declared the first covenant promises to the Jews null, and void. The truth of course is that the physical descendents of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, had, and will continue to have a crucial, and vital role in the historical, and redemptive purposes of the Father. Replacement theology declares that the Jews are no different than any other people group, and that their chosen status was self appointed, and has ceased when their "European" non Jewish (Jesus) went to the cross.

The truth of course is that no other nation before or since has been earmarked by Yahuwah to work out His redemptive, and earthly will, as has Israel (12 tribes).



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sharky

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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

Post  sharky on Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:15 pm

barnacle bill wrote:
el kabong wrote:Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia thumbs up

Europe is a LARGER Continent then Australia. As a matter of FACT; Australia is the SMALLEST/RUNT Continent. And as large it may be, the size of your EGO makes it uncomfortably confining. But hey, that's only one of your many lies and deceptions. Let's talk about Mizraim, the Hebrew word for Egypt. You say it isn't. Where is your credentialed support for your ignorant nonsense? thumbs up

http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Mizraim.html

Meaning and etymology of the name Mizraim
Mizraim


Mizraim is a son of Ham, son of Noah (Genesis 12:10). This name is also the common name for Egypt (which is also known as 'the land of Ham,', for instance in Psalm 105:23).

Egypt was known by the names Musuru, Musru, Misir or Masri in other languages, and Mizraim is probably simply a phonetic transliteration into Hebrew of any of them. The word looks identical to what a dual form of would look like (see below). This duality possibly helped to denote Upper and Lower Egypt. The word for Egyptian is .

The similar (masor), a poetic nickname for Egypt that is used on three different occasions (Isaiah 19:6, 2 Kings 19:24 = Isaiah 37:25, Micah 7:12), may shed some understanding on how a Hebrew audience might have interpreted the name Mizraim.

The noun (masor) means siege, entrenchment, and it derives from the verb (sur), bind, besiege. Another derivation of this same verb is the noun , stronghold. HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament notes that a stronghold or walled city may be an instrument of protection during the first stages of a war, but will turn into a lethal trap if a siege last long. A beautiful figurative use of this word occurs in Psalm 31:21, where the author compares himself under siege by his troubles.

The verb from which the noun derives, is part of a group of five different roots. These roots all have different linguistic sources but were perhaps readily incorporated into the Hebrew language due to similar or related meanings, more or less:
(swr) is the assumed root of the words (sawwar), neck and (sawwaron), necklace. The neck is simply a part of the body, but figuratively it is used as seat of strength (Job 39:19) and subsequently as target of defeat (by the placing of the victor's foot on the neck of the conquered - Joshua 10:24). The similarity between a necklace and a besieging army is obvious.
The verb (sur) means to bind or besiege; referred to above.
The verb (sur) means show hostility to, be an adversary. According to BDB Theological Dictionary and HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is probably a by-form of (sarar), see below.
The verb (sur) means to form or fashion. According to HAW Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, this verb is possibly a by-form of (yasar), form or fashion.
The noun (sur) does not occur in the Bible, but is probably related to words in cognate languages that mean rock or hill. A derivative that does occur in the Bible is (sur), the common Biblical word for rock. BDB Theological Dictionary suggests relations with (sara), see below.

The words and are linguistically closely related. Their respective meanings also shows much kinship:
The verb (sarar) means to bind, be narrow/ confined, be in distress. Derivatives are: (sar), narrow, tight; (sar), distress; (sara), straights, distress; (sarar), suffer distress; (seror), bundle; (mesar), straights, distress. The latter word written in a dual form would yield the name , Mizraim. Jones' Dictionary of Old Testament Proper Names assumed that this is what Mizraim would have meant to a Hebrew audience and reads Double Distress.
The verb (sarar) means show hostility towards. Derivation (sar) means adversary.
The assumed root (srr) is unused in the Bible but in Arabic it means be sharp. Its common derivative is (sar), pebble, flint.

The name Mizraim means Double Distress or Double Stronghold.



Bible Dictionary

Mizraim definition


the dual form of matzor, meaning a "mound" or "fortress," the name of a people descended from Ham (Gen. 10:6, 13; 1 Chr. 1:8, 11). It was the name generally given by the Hebrews to the land of Egypt (q.v.), and may denote the two Egypts, the Upper and the Lower. The modern Arabic name for Egypt is Muzr.


Mizraim From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mizraim
Mizraim (Hebrew: מִצְרַיִם / מִצְרָיִם, Modern Mitzráyim Tiberian Miṣrāyim / Miṣráyim ; cf. Arabic مصر, Miṣr) is the Hebrew name for the land of Egypt, with the dual suffix -āyim, perhaps referring to the "two Egypts": Upper Egypt and Lower Egypt.

Ugaritic inscriptions refer to Egypt as Msrm, in the Amarna tablets it is called Misri, and Assyrian and Babylonian records called Egypt Musur and Musri. The Arabic word for Egypt is Misr (pronounced Masr in Egyptian colloquial Arabic), and Egypt's official name is Gumhuriyah Misr al-'Arabiyah (the Arab Republic of Egypt).

According to Genesis 10, Mizraim (a son of Ham) was the younger brother of Cush and elder brother of Phut and Canaan, whose families together made up the Hamite branch of Noah's descendants. Mizraim's sons were Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, Casluhim (out of whom came Philistim), and Caphtorim.[1]

According to Eusebius' Chronicon, Manetho had suggested that the great age of antiquity in which the later Egyptians boasted had actually preceded the flood, and that they were really descended from Mizraim, who settled there anew. A similar story is related by medieval Islamic historians such as Sibt ibn al-Jawzi, the Egyptian Ibn Abd-el-Hakem, and the Persians al-Tabari and Muhammad Khwandamir, stating that the pyramids, etc. had been built by the wicked races before the deluge, but that Noah's descendant Mizraim (Masar or Mesr) was entrusted with reoccupying the region afterward. The Islamic accounts also make Masar the son of a Bansar or Beisar and grandson of Ham, rather than a direct son of Ham, and add that he lived to the age of 700. Some scholars think it likely that Mizraim is a dual form of the word Misr meaning "land", and was translated literally into Ancient Egyptian as Ta-Wy (the Two Lands) by early pharaohs at Thebes, who later founded the Middle Kingdom.

But according to George Syncellus, the Book of Sothis, supposedly by Manetho, had identified Mizraim with the legendary first pharaoh Menes, said to have unified the Old Kingdom and built Memphis. Misraim also seems to correspond to Misor, said in Phoenician mythology to have been father of Taautus who was given Egypt, and later scholars noticed that this also recalls Menes, whose son or successor was said to be Athothis.

In Judaism, Mitzrayim has been connected with the word meitzar (מיצר), meaning "sea strait", possibly alluding to narrow gulfs from both sides of Sinai peninsula. It also can mean "boundaries, limits, restrictions" or "narrow place".[citation needed]

However, author David Rohl has suggested a different interpretation: "Amongst the followers of Meskiagkasher [Cush] was his younger 'brother' -- in his own right a strong and charismatic leader of men. He is the head of the falcon tribe -- the descendants of Horus the 'Far Distant'. The Bible calls this new Horus-king 'Mizraim' but this name is, in reality, no more than an epithet. It means 'follower of Asr' or 'Asar' (Arabic m-asr with the Egyptian preposition m 'from'). Mizraim is merely m-Izra with the majestic plural ending 'im'. Likewise, that other great Semitic-speaking people -- the Assyrians -- called the country of the pharaohs 'Musri' (m-Usri)." [2]


Genesis 10 - The Table of Nations
http://www.enduringword.com/commentaries/0110.htm
The tenth chapter of Genesis . . . stands absolutely alone in ancient literature, without a remote parallel, even among the Greeks, where we find the closest approach to a distribution of peoples in genealogical framework . . . The Table of Nations remains an astonishing accurate document. (William F. Albright, cited in Boice)

A. The descendants of Japheth.

1. (1) The three sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

Now this is the genealogy of the sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth. And sons were born to them after the flood.

2. (2) The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

The sons of Japheth were Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras.

a. The sons of Japheth: He was the father of the Indo-European peoples, those stretching from India to the shores of Western Europe. They are each linked by linguistic similarities that often seem invisible to the layman but are much more obvious to the linguist.

b. Gomer: From this son of Japheth came the Germanic peoples, from whom came most of the original peoples of Western Europe. These include the original French, Spanish, and Celtic settlers.

c. Magog . . . Tubal, Meshech: These settled in the far north of Europe and became the Russian peoples.

d. Madai: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Medes and they populated what are now Iran and Iraq. The peoples of India also came from this branch of Japheth’s family.

e. Javan: From this son of Japheth came the ancient Greeks, whose sea-faring ways are described in Genesis 10:5.

3. (3) The sons of Gomer.

The sons of Gomer were Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah.

a. Ashkenaz: From this son of Gomer came the peoples who settled north of Judea into what we call the Fertile Crescent.

b. Togarmah: From this son of Gomer came the Armenians.

4. (4-5) The sons of Javan (the ancient Greeks).

The sons of Javan were Elishah, Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim. From these the coastland peoples of the Gentiles were separated into their lands, everyone according to his language, according to their families, into their nations.

a. The sons of Javan were: Geographic names that spring from these names in this chapter abound. Linguists have no trouble seeing the connection between Kittim and Cyprus, Rodanim and Rhodes, Gomer and Germany, Meschech and Moscow, Tubal and Tobolsk.

B. The descendants of Ham.

1. (6) The sons of Ham: Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

The sons of Ham were Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan.

a. Ham: The descendants of Ham are the peoples who populated Africa and the Far East.

b. Cush: Apparently, this family divided into two branches early. Some founded Babylon (notably, Nimrod) and others founded Ethiopia.

c. Mizraim: This is another way the Bible refers to Egypt. Put refers to Libya, the region of North Africa west of Egypt. Canaan refers to the peoples who originally settled the land we today think of as Israel and its surrounding regions.
2. (7-12) The sons of Cush.

The sons of Cush were Seba, Havilah, Sabtah, Raamah, and Sabtechah; and the sons of Raamah were Sheba and Dedan. Cush begot Nimrod; he began to be a mighty one on the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord; therefore it is said, “Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord.” And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, Erech, Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar. From that land he went to Assyria and built Nineveh, Rehoboth Ir, Calah, and Resen between Nineveh and Calah (that is the principal city).



a. Cush begot Nimrod: One son of Cush worthy of note is Nimrod. He was a mighty one on the earth, but not in a good way. He ruled over Babel, which was the first organized rebellion of humans against God. The name Nimrod itself means, “let us rebel.”



b. Like Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord: The context shows that this is not a compliment of Nimrod. The idea is that Nimrod was an offense before the face of God.



i. “This is not talking about Nimrod’s ability to hunt wild game. He was not a hunter of animals. He was a hunter of men - a warrior. It was through his ability to fight and kill and rule ruthlessly that his kingdom of the Euphrates valley city states was consolidated.” (Boice)



ii. A Jerusalem Targum says: “He was powerful in hunting and in wickedness before the Lord, for he was a hunter of the sons of men, and he said to them, ‘Depart from the judgment of the Lord, and adhere to the judgment of Nimrod!’ Therefore it is said: ‘As Nimrod the strong one, strong in hunting, and in wickedness before the Lord.’ ”



iii. Ginzberg quotes from a Jewish legend: “The great success that attended all of Nimrod’s undertakings produced a sinister effect. Men no longer trusted in God, but rather in their own prowess and ability, an attitude to which Nimrod tried to convert the whole world.”

iv. “Hence it is likely that Nimrod, having acquired power, used it in tyranny and oppression; and by rapine and violence founded the domination which was the first distinguished by the name of a kingdom on the face of the earth. How many kingdoms have been founded in the same way, in various ages and nations from that time to the present! From the Nimrods of the earth, God deliver the world!” (Clarke)

3. (13-14) The sons of Mizraim.

Mizraim begot Ludim, Anamim, Lehabim, Naphtuhim, Pathrusim, and Casluhim (from whom came the Philistines and Caphtorim).

4. (15-19) The sons of Canaan.

Canaan begot Sidon his firstborn, and Heth; the Jebusite, the Amorite, and the Girgashite; the Hivite, the Arkite, and the Sinite; the Arvadite, the Zemarite, and the Hamathite. Afterward the families of the Canaanites were dispersed. And the border of the Canaanites was from Sidon as you go toward Gerar, as far as Gaza; then as you go toward Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, and Zeboiim, as far as Lasha.

a. Canaan begot Sidon: The family of Sidon, the son of Canaan, went north and is related to the Hittites and Lebanese.

b. And the Sinite: Many people believe the Oriental peoples descended from the Sinites.

5. (20) The spread of the descendants of Ham.

These were the sons of Ham, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands and in their nations.

C. The descendants of Shem.

1. (21-22) The sons of Shem: Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

And children were born also to Shem, the father of all the children of Eber, the brother of Japheth the elder. The sons of Shem were Elam, Asshur, Arphaxad, Lud, and Aram.

a. Children were born also to Shem: From Shem comes Elam, who was an ancestor to the Persian peoples; Asshur, who was the father of the Assyrians; Lud was father to the Lydians who lived for a time in Asia Minor; and Aram was father to the Arameans, who we also know as the Syrians. Arphaxad was the ancestor to Abram and the Hebrews.

2. (23) The sons of Aram.

The sons of Aram were Uz, Hul, Gether, and Mash.

a. Uz: Later, a region in Arabia was named after this son of Aram.

Job came from the land of Uz (Job 1:1).

3. (24-30) The sons and descendants of Arphaxad.

Arphaxad begot Salah, and Salah begot Eber. To Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg, for in his days the earth was divided; and his brother’s name was Joktan. Joktan begot Almodad, Sheleph, Hazarmaveth, Jerah, Hadoram, Uzal, Diklah, Obal, Abimael, Sheba, Ophir, Havilah, and Jobab. All these were the sons of Joktan. And their dwelling place was from Mesha as you go toward Sephar, the mountain of the east.

a. All these were the sons of Joktan: The names under the son of Joktan (son of Eber, son of Salah, son of Arphaxad) are all associated with various Arabic peoples.

b. And Jobab: The one named Jobab may be the one we know as Job in the Old Testament.

4. (31) The spread of the descendants of Shem.

These were the sons of Shem, according to their families, according to their languages, in their lands, according to their nations.
5. (32) Summary statement: the nations after the flood.

These were the families of the sons of Noah, according to their generations, in their nations; and from these the nations were divided on the earth after the flood.

a. “Hence one must consider this chapter of Genesis a mirror in which to discern that we human beings are, namely, creatures so marred by sin that we have no knowledge of our own origin, not even of God Himself, our Creator, unless the Word of God reveals these sparks of divine light to us from afar . . . This knowledge the Holy Scriptures reveal to us. Those who are without them live in error, uncertainty, and boundless ungodliness; for they have no knowledge about who they are and whence they came.” (Luther, cited in Boice)
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MIZRAIM = EGYPT

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You also deceive about the Replacement/Superssessionism Theology......This is Strike 3 and a few more to go. thumbs up

http://www.biblestudyproject.org/israel3.1-replacement-theology-messianic.htm

The Truth

We believe Israel is God's special people, distinct from the body of Messiah, chosen by Him to be a holy nation and a Kingdom of priests. The election of Israel is irrevocable. . . . We believe the Abrahamic Covenant is an irrevocable, unconditional covenant God made with Jewish people. This covenant provides title to the land of Israel for the Jewish people and promises a descendant (the Messiah) who would come to redeem Israel and bless the entire world. The spiritual blessings of the Abrahamic Covenant overflow to all the nations. God will ultimately fulfill every aspect of the covenant in the Messianic Kingdom, both physical and spiritual. . . .
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Your LIE!!!!!!!

A. SUPERSESSIONISM OR REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY

The meaning of this doctrine is that the church superseded or replaced Israel as God's covenant people. The three claims presented under this heading are:
1. God has rejected Israel,
2. the church has replaced Israel as God's covenant people, and
3. the church is therefore spiritual Israel.

If God has rejected Israel, then that clears the way for a replacement people; and if that people is the church, then the church may be considered spiritual Israel. It is also conceivable that some who believe that Israel is still God's covenant people would consider the church spiritual Israel because it is composed of people whose spirits have been regenerated by the Holy Spirit. We will now hold the light of Scripture to these claims and possibilities.
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Paul follows his emphatic response with, for I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. . . . What is his point? If God had rejected Israel as His covenant people, then every Israelite would be disqualified from the possibility of being saved; yet he is an Israelite who is saved, and that proves that God has not rejected His people.

To sum up, we have noticed two proofs that God has not rejected Israel as His covenant people:
1. By the very meaning of May it never be! in the way that Paul used it in different contexts.
2. By the fact that Paul was a saved Israelite.


Nevertheless, we'll address several passages that need clarification.

b. Romans 11:1-5

1. I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2. God has not rejected His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says in the passage about Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel? 3. "Lord, THEY HAVE KILLED YOUR PROPHETS, THEY HAVE TORN DOWN YOUR ALTARS, AND I ALONE AM LEFT, AND THEY ARE SEEKING MY LIFE." 4. But what is the divine response to him? "I HAVE KEPT for Myself SEVEN THOUSAND MEN WHO HAVE NOT BOWED THE KNEE TO BAAL." 5. In the same way then, there has also come to be at the present time a remnant according to God's gracious choice.



Replacement Theology

Its Origins, Teachings and Errors

By Dr. Gary Hedrick, President of CJF Ministries

(With Minor Editing By Rabbi Loren)

http://www.shema.com/Combating%20Replacement%20Theology/crt-004.php

http://www.therefinersfire.org/replacement_theology.htm

These are serious errors/deformations in your Theology and Worldview. What do you have to say for yourself. You gibber on and on about being persecuted yet you, yourself; are the persecuter. You lie about the Jews and their Sacred scriptures and you attempt to steal their identity and destiny, without being able to read/write Hebrew. Your ignorance and hubris is appalling Capiche? thumbs up


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Re: Mizraim means Egypt. Zion is Israel, NOT Australia

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